IN MY POOL!

[flyfishpj 0]

Sorry I don't have any pictures, but the other day I found a nymph in my pool. It actually looked like a scud. The weird thing is, I live in Nevada. Does anyone know what it could be?

[Taxon 0]

Sorry I don't have any pictures, but the other day I found a nymph in my pool. It actually looked like a scud. The weird thing is, I live in Nevada. Does anyone know what it could be?

flyfishpj-

 

Not aware of anything that looks like a scud, but isn't one. Are you thinking there are no scuds in Nevada? In any event, if you want to know what your pool resident may be, you'll either need to get a picture of it, or at least do a better job of describing it's physical appearance.

 

For example: length in millimeters; whether the body appears compressed from the top and bottom, or from the sides, or is round in profile; whether or not the body is tapered toward the rear; whether or not it has an obvious head; how many body segments it appears to have; how many legs or other appendages, and where they are located relative to the body segments; whether or not any antennae are visible, and if so, how long relative to the head; whether or not it has any tail-like appendages, and if so, how many, and how long compared the body; general coloration, and if multiple colors are involved, where they are located; how it appears to moves in the water, etc. Any of these attributes you can remember will greatly assist in identification.

 

[flyfishpj 0]

Sorry abou that, Taxon. Not really great on entomology, learning though. About the scuds in Nevada, I was just thinking of how it could possibly get to my pool. Well, I lost it before I got a picture so I will describe it. To tell the truth, the only thing about it that looked like a scud was it's whitish yellow color. That was the only thing I could compare it to. It was 3/4 inches long and had two tails that were 3 or 4 centimeters each. It looked like a mayfly nymph, whith the split tails and the body shape. It was relatively flat and it was tapered the closer you get to the tail. It looked like it had three body segments, no antenneas visible and, like I said, it was whitish yellow.It was just sort of curled up when I found it, floating about a foot of the bottom. Unlike a mayfly nymph, it had a bunch of little legs under it like a scud, instead of outspread long legs. Hope this helps!

 

 

 

Pj

[nightfish 0]

My guess is that it was transported by a bird, attached to a leg or trapped in belly feathers. The color will not indicate what species, because the pool chemicals will bleach out the color. However, due to the size and your location, I would have to guess it was a brown drake nymph, which are commonly found in the canals & golf course ponds

[Taxon 0]

Sorry abou that, Taxon. Not really great on entomology, learning though. About the scuds in Nevada, I was just thinking of how it could possibly get to my pool. Well, I lost it before I got a picture so I will describe it. To tell the truth, the only thing about it that looked like a scud was it's whitish yellow color. That was the only thing I could compare it to. It was 3/4 inches long and had two tails that were 3 or 4 centimeters each. It looked like a mayfly nymph, whith the split tails and the body shape. It was relatively flat and it was tapered the closer you get to the tail. It looked like it had three body segments, no antenneas visible and, like I said, it was whitish yellow.It was just sort of curled up when I found it, floating about a foot of the bottom. Unlike a mayfly nymph, it had a bunch of little legs under it like a scud, instead of outspread long legs. Hope this helps!

Pj

Pj-

 

Okay, humor me while I strive for understanding. Insect body length measurements are from the front of the head to the back of the abdomen, and don't include the tails. Is that the way you came up with 3/4", or did you include the length of the tails?

 

Also, tail length of 3 or 4 centimeters is 30 or 40 millimeters or ~1 1/5" to ~1 1/2". Is that really what you meant?

 

Also, a mayfly nymph would have (6) multi-jointed legs, which could seem to be more, as they are usually all folded up in an expired nymph, but all six would originate from the front third of the body. Are you certain this thing in your pool actually had legs originating along entire length of its body?

 

Don’t mean to unnecessarily belabor this, but I trying to avoid going off in the wrong direction regarding an attempt at identification.

[flyfishpj 0]

No, I didn't include the length of the tails, so the body was about 3/4 inches long, and the tail was 30 to 40 centimeters. About the legs, sorry, like I said, I am not good on entomology. It looked like they kind of deteriorated away because I think the thing was dead when I found it.

[Taxon 0]

Pj-

 

Let’s assume your observations are reasonably accurate, and convert your length estimates to millimeters, so we have them in a common unit. So, this is what we have now:

---------------------

Body length: ~19 mm. (3/4”)

Body compressed from top and bottom: apparently not

Body compressed from sides: apparently not

Body round in profile: apparently (more or less)

Body tapered toward rear: yes

Number of body segments: 3 (presumably head, thorax, abdomen)

How many legs or leg-like appendages: uncertain, but seemed like a lot

From which body segment(s) the legs the leg-like appendages originated: uncertain

Any antennae on head: none apparent

Length of antennae relative to head: not applicable

Any tail-like appendages: yes

Number of tail-like appendages: 2? (split tails)

Length of tail-like appendages: 30 – 40 mm. (3-4 cm.)

Length of tail-like appendages relative to body: between 1.58/1 and 2.11/1

Body coloration: whitish yellow

How it moves in water: unknown

Impressions: reminded of a scud due to legs and color; otherwise mayfly nymph-like

Location: found expired near bottom of swimming pool in Nevada

---------------------

The reason I grilled you earlier about the respective body and tail lengths was that they seemed unlikely for a mayfly nymph, or for that matter, for any invertebrate of which I could think.

 

To demonstrate that for mayfly nymphs, I selected the those which attain a length (at maturity) of 18 mm. or longer, which yielded 11 species in 5 genera for N. America. Then, I calculated body length/tail length ratios for each. Then, I recorded whether or not each resided in Nevada. This produced the following:

 

-------- Mayfly ----------- Min --- Max --- T/B Ratio --- In NV? -

Ephemera blanda ------ 12 ---- 18 ------ .34/1 -------- no

Ephemera guttulata --- 15 ---- 30 ------ .36/1 -------- no

Ephemera simulans --- 10 ---- 21 ------ .34/1 ------- yes

Hexagenia atrocaudata 16 ---- 26 ------ .39/1 -------- no

Hexagenia bilineata --- 18 ---- 25 ------ .38/1 -------- no

Hexagenia limbata ---- 17 ---- 37 ------ .38/1 ------- yes

Hexagenia rigida ------ 20 ---- 30 ------ .33/1 -------- no

Isonychia bicolor ------ 12 ---- 18 ------ .44/1 -------- no

Isonychia velma ------- 13 ---- 19 ------ .40/1 -------- no

Litobrancha recurvata 16 ---- 40 -------.35/1 -------- no

Siphloplecton basale - 13 ---- 20 ------ .38/1 -------- no

 

The bottom line would seem to be that your critter can’t be a mayfly nymph, as none of the mayfly nymphs achieving a body length approaching 3/4" have (body length to tail length) ratios of more than .44/1, a far cry from your 3-4 cm. estimate, which yielded a ratio of somewhere between 1.58/1 and 2.11/1.

 

So, I expanded the search to include other invertebrates (both aquatic and terrestrial), but couldn’t find any with a body length approaching 3/4" and a body/tail length ratio approaching your observation.

 

This is not to imply you didn’t see a critter like you describe in your pool, only that I’ve failed miserably in my quest to determine what it might have been. If anyone else has a thought as to what it might have been, please offer it up, as I'm really stumped.

 

[Steeldrifter 0]

If anyone else has a thought as to what it might have been, please offer it up, as I'm really stumped.

 

That's like Bill Gates saying he has a computer glitch he can't fix, can someone else

 

if Taxon can't figure it out then I don't think we can

[flyfishpj 0]

Well, I just found another and my camera needs batteries so I can explain it further in a few minutes. Lemme get it.

[flyfishpj 0]

Ok, I go it. Lemme see if I can reexplain this. This one I found alive so it has features that I didn't find on the dead one. This one was clinged to the bottom and would crawl wen I went for it. It tried to crawl on the ground when I brought it up but couldln't and then remained when I put it in a cup. The measurements are different from my first one. This one is a bit smaller but will be more accurate. The body itself is 6 cm. It tapers down and has a small pointy tail that curls up that is only 1\2 cm and splits in two tiny tiny points at the end.. It is flat, like I said in the second post, and this is much different in color, probably b/c it is alive. It is brown with a little grey mixed in. It has two antenneas that are each 1 cm. It has 12(6 on each side) legs that are small and go down straight beneath it. They get longer as you go back. The average size of them is 1 cm. The top looks almost like a rolly polly(excuse my kiddish language) because it is armored. This one looks as if it only has one body section. Like I said, the first was sort of a guess. That is the best I can describe it. I have it now so if you have a question that I missed, just ask.

 

One more thing Taxon. You seem to know a heck of a lot. Where did you learn all this? What is the best way for me to learn?

[Steeldrifter 0]

Taxon is the man when it comes to Entomology flyfishpj. Check out his site, theres alot of good info on it.

 

http://www.flyfishingentomology.com/

[Taxon 0]

Ok, I go it. Lemme see if I can reexplain this. This one I found alive so it has features that I didn't find on the dead one. This one was clinged to the bottom and would crawl wen I went for it. It tried to crawl on the ground when I brought it up but couldln't and then remained when I put it in a cup. The measurements are different from my first one. This one is a bit smaller but will be more accurate. The body itself is 6 cm. It tapers down and has a small pointy tail that curls up that is only 1\2 cm and splits in two tiny tiny points at the end.. It is flat, like I said in the second post, and this is much different in color, probably b/c it is alive. It is brown with a little grey mixed in. It has two antenneas that are each 1 cm. It has 12(6 on each side) legs that are small and go down straight beneath it. They get longer as you go back. The average size of them is 1 cm. The top looks almost like a rolly polly(excuse my kiddish language) because it is armored. This one looks as if it only has one body section. Like I said, the first was sort of a guess. That is the best I can describe it. I have it now so if you have a question that I missed, just ask.

 

One more thing Taxon. You seem to know a heck of a lot. Where did you learn all this? What is the best way for me to learn?

Pj-

 

Geez, I sure wish you would borrow someone's digital camera with a macro feature, take a picture of your critter, and post it in this thread.

 

Anyway, I'm going to answer your last question first. I recommend that you acquire a book to help you identify aquatic invertebrates. The one I am currently recommending to start out with is: Guide to Aquatic Invertebrates of the Upper Midwest by R.W. Bouchard Jr. It's free if you have time to download and print the chapters individually, then get it spiral-bound. Of course, another option is to just access the chapters via your computer, but I far prefer to be able to look at a printed book. A third option, and certainly the simplist is to just order a spiral-bound book for $25, and have them send it to you. In any event, don't worry about the geographic location in the title, as it only goes down to family level, and there are exactly the same invertebrate families throughout N. America.

 

Why don't you start by downolading Chapter 2. Take a look at the aquatic invertebrate illustrations, see if you recognize anything, and then get back to me and we can discuss it.

 

[Taxon 0]

Taxon is the man when it comes to Entomology flyfishpj. Check out his site, theres alot of good info on it.

 

http://www.flyfishingentomology.com/

Steve-

 

Thanks for the kind words.

[flyfishpj 0]

 

It looks very similar to a springtail. However, the one I found was darker and was much more flat

 

[Taxon 0]

Pj-

 

Well, I wouldn't worry about color, as there are many genera and species or most invertebrates, so they customarily come in some variety of colors. Many times, even the exact same species will be differently colored based on geographic location, environment, etc. Sometimes, the exact same species is found in multiple colors in the exact same location, i.e. a kicknet sample.

 

Of more concern would be shape and size. In the case of springtails, the largest they get is only about 10% as large as your 3/4" critter. However, I assume you're indicating that the shape resembles that of a springtail, only flatter.

 

In any event, I'm really hoping that you will be able take a photo of your critter, and post it in this thread. As soon as you do that, there will likely be someone who will join in and identify it before I have even seen it. And even if not, I should be able to identify it to some degree or another. Think camera!!!!!