Guest Report post Posted August 24, 2003 TroutBum, yes you did it! That philosophical questioning of what is a fly, or fly fishing really yanks my chain sometimes. Sorry, about my apparent distain at your question. You are certainly entitled to your opinions, and debate is healthy at times. If you would allow me to explain my position, I think you'll see why I went off. I have the utmost respect for traditions, and traditional values, however, I also respect every individuals right to deviate from traditions as long as it's legal. To each his own. I grew up in an area where there were no trout available to me, only bass, panfish & various tidewater species. I was at one time fascinated by trout fishing, and of course the flies involved. As I got old enough to travel, I discovered that trout fishing was not all that great, at least not to me, and this is simply my opinion. I discovered that I enjoyed fly fishing for bass much more than for trout. Anyway, there used to be an Orvis fly shop in MD that I went to sometimes to buy tying materials, and on one occasion had gathered together what I wanted, except for some hackle. When I inquired about hackle for tying bass flies the owner of the shop attempted to sell me very expensive dry fly hackle. I knew what I wanted, and that wasn't it. He then told me that he didn't carry other hackle. When I told him I wanted it to tie bass flies, and that I didn't trout fish much, he told me that if I didn't fish for trout I had no business fly fishing! Well, anyway, that really made me mad, & I've never thought very highly of that type of smug, holier than thou attitude, and told the guy to shove it. To this day that type of attitude still raises my hackles. Expressing one's opinion is fine, but when someone tries to tell me their opinion is the only correct one, I just get a real nasty attitude. Whatever you feel about flies or fly fishing is fine with me, just don't tell me I'm wrong because of the way I feel. There is no right or wrong as far I'm concerned. Again, to each his own. Not that you were saying your opinion was right, but questioning the idea of "what is a fly" also sets me off sometimes, and I apologize for that. Next time I'll just say "there he goes again" and I'll make a note not to send you any epoxy flies! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted August 25, 2003 Jim, You had every right to get ticked off at that Orvis dealer. He was absolutely wrong. I am not one of those trout snobs, after all, I do live in Florida. My preference happens to be fishing for trout on small streams, but living where I do, I am fortunate to have some wonderful species to throw a fly at. My choice in flys is to use natural materials when they're available, it just seems "right" to me. Granted they won't last as long as man-made materials, but I tie my own, so it doesn't really matter to me. The important thing is I fooled the fish with something I made. I went Snook fishing yesterday morning, caught four fish and had four Seaducers torn up in the process. Now I have the pleasure of re-tying those hooks and in the process reliving each catch. TroutBum Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted August 25, 2003 TroutBum, you and I are on the same page, no hard feelings! Yes, that guy was a real jerk! Everyone that I talked to that had any contact with the guy said the same thing about him. That shop eventually went out of business. Seaducers are great flies, I use them for tidal bass, and if you add a little cactus chenille to the body...................., oh, I forgot you don't care for the synthetics! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RunninDetox 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 I have no problem using synthetic materials myself (try to avoid them, but if the occasion calls for it, I have no problem). But anyhow, I hate using the hot glue, I found a great trick I like to use. Buy a jar of the rubber eggs (make sure they are not the ones that smell like Sambuca (found they don't work as well)). I then take a red thread on a needle and feed it through about 4 or 5 eggs. Tie that on the hook and add some white yarn or whatever you like (immitates the skeen). Give this a try and I promise you won't be dissapointed. Jay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Houdini 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 The only time I have any problem is with some of the siliskin "flies" that end up being almost a duplicate of plastic lures. I saw one that ended up looking like a plastic minnow - complete with flash. I'd rather spin fish something like that. The debate is lost on me in that I tend to use the best tool I can for the situation. That means that while I prefer to flyfish, I don't head for the salt without my surf rod and tackle. If the wind is blowing hard - I don't fight it - I rig up the baitcaster or spinning rods. And I take a ultralight spinnning rod along even when I trout fish. I'll throw a real curve here - I actually troll with a flyrod! Imagine! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steelie 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 Good Day, Easier and must faster to create than most other egg patterns. However, having a full rotoary vise helps along with a cold glass of water. Put a drop of glue on the hook, rotate for even round shape, drop in water. As far as them being flies.... I would not be caught with them on our flies only stretches here in Michigan. Granted, it is somewhat up to the dicretion of the C.O. but, I know people who have gotten in trouble with them, not worth it. In non fly only, they can be a killer! Steelie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Crotalus 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 In my opinion it is the thread that consitutes a fly. It doesnt really matter what the materials are, as long as they are tied onto the hook with thread, then it is a fly. Am i going to get bent out of shape if someone creates a glue egg, calls it a fly and fishes with it? Nope probably not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cornmuse 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 If you're not fishing upstream with a dry fly you're poaching. Might as well be fishing with worms... :j_k: 100 years ago it was "traditional" to fish a strip of chamois behind a spinner on a fly rod. That's still one of my favorite artificials. If you self impose rules as to how big a hook you'll use, what kind of materials you'll use, which direction you'll fish and what fish are acceptable to the sport as you love it - good for you! This is so much more than a sport to many of us and as such it should fulfill you emotionally, spiritually and as a form of entertainment. In fact, if you like a good fish dinner, then I have no truck with a stringer of trout, bass or other fish. It's legal, ethical and acceptable *TO ME*. While I might not take fish myself, what you do is up to you.:shifty: It seems to me that if the item tied to your tippet doesn't imitate an insect, it's not a "FLY" be definition. Brits call 'em "lures" for a reason. This is a debate that's decades old and completely irrelevant to the actual practice of the sport. Speaking only for me, if I can cast it on a fly rod then it's a fly rod artificial. I'm certainly not turning my back on modern technology and materials - unlike the Taliban I have no desire to regress to a way of life hundreds of years old. I'm quite happy with modern medicine, the internal combustion engine, Goretex and epoxy flies. :yahoo: YMMV Tight lines! Joe C. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steelie 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 Good Day, Follow up - As long as it is within the letter of the law... but even so, albeit legal, it may not be ethical... I would rather err on the side of caution as our C.O.'s can be a bit tough. Steelie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dble Haul 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 For more about the "what is a fly" subject, I refer you to this piece from a while ago.... http://www.flytyingforum.com/index.php?act...e&article_id=36 Just one man's humble opinion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishyfranky 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 There may be legality in glue, beads, weighted flys etc, but no morality nor ethics. Fly fishing only areas are a scarlet stain on fly fishers as a whole and I hang my head in shame by association. I spent over 20 years hemming and hawing on whether I should fly fish simply because of this snobbish elitism. It was only after the birth of my first child and numerous diaper changes that I was able to deal with this. For fisheries management purposes, I have no issue with catch & release, single barbless hooks and no organic bait. This enables all tax and license paying citizens the right to fish with no bias nor discrimination. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sage8wt 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2005 There was much discussion of this awhile back on a different local forum.......Michigan, in the fable waters of the P.M. Basically if I my memory serves me correctly the conclussion that was reached was one in such it is completely up to the individual C.O.'s discretion (as Steelie stated). However, it would be acceptable for an angler to present a glue egg in fly's only sections as long as there was some sort of material (synthetic or natural) attached to the hook as well. Such as adding, a crystal flash tail or some egg yarn in front to create a killer nuke egg. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hywel 0 Report post Posted December 18, 2005 To answer the original question; Yes, I use hot glue to form the 'egg' in any number of fly patterns that call for it. Do they sink? I use a sink tip. *g* On an aside; Are they flies? I think so. http://www.rackelhanen.com/eng/10215.htm Hywel Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kodiak Commando 0 Report post Posted December 18, 2005 This is a sore subject for many alaskan fly fisherman because of how big rainbows and char depend on eggs. In the early days glo bugs worked fine but now a lot of the big bows are too smart for glo bugs and really the only consitent way to catch them in the fall is by using a glue egg or even better, pegging a bead. A pegged bead is definetely not a traditinal fly but anyone who uses it is still using a fly rod, fly reel and fly line so i still think it is fly fishing. Ironically, though bead catch more fish, they have helped the fish in my opinion. Because when a bow decides to take and egg pattern they will often go full out and glo bugs and glue gun eggs result in many gut hooking incidents esppecially for steelies. Because a bead is pegged above the hook you are less likely to hurt a fish. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyfisher825 0 Report post Posted September 18, 2009 Does anyone use glue eggs? Does the glue float? Thanks :dunno: Wow thanks for the response and I really am looking for a "how to" regarding how to make hot glue salmon egg flies. Nothing spectacular just simple and to the point. I have to step out for awhile but I will be back. Fall Salmon run is on my mind, and I can't shake it. Thanks again. flyfisher825 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites