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TomRC

Rotary or Non Rotary Vise Revisited

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I’m a relative newbie as I just started tying last February. I’ve found myself tying mainly size 14 Gold Ribbed Hares Ears, Prince Nymphs, Pheasant Tails, Elk Hair Caddis, Stimulators and some others dry fly and nymphs. I bought a Renzetti Traveler which has functioned flawlessly but have found that I rarely use the rotary features other than to look at the fly from various angles to trim and tidy up but not for wrapping hackle, ribs or other materials. What I do wish that I had was better access to the rear of the hook (ie working on scud hooks, tying in biots, etc). I also want to start tying midges and some others smaller flies. I also have found it interesting since I’ve started tying that rarely do I see on fly tying tutorials or videos the tier actually using the rotational feature for applying material but rather just to rotate the fly occasionally to see how it looks or for trimming purposes. Although I don’t need a better vise than the Renzetti Traveler I have decided to sell it and am really thinking about getting a rotation (non axis) vise like the HMH with midge jaws. This way I could still rotate the fly but because I could angle the head (which I can’t on my Traveler) I could set it up for optimal access to the rear of the hook plus those HMH midge jaws look “real cool" for tying tiny flies which will be my next endeavor.

 

Maybe I’m missing the boat here but other than reading on forums about how “must have” on axis rotational vises are, rarely do I see tiers in instructional videos taking advantage of this. I’ve even watched quite a few video tutorials of people using my dream vise (Law Vise) and am not seeing the rotary function being used for other than what I mentioned above. I do however see that quite often people using the Law Vises or other vises that allow for the head to be angled upwards doing so to ensure better access to the rear of the hook and better hook access in general. Am I missing the boat hear???? Would I be disappointed moving from a Traveler to an HMH? Thanks for any input.

 

Tom

 

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Good Day,

 

I also own a Traveler. I use the rotary function all the time. Primarily for palmering materials onto the fly, but also to check the progress of the fly as well.

 

Steelie

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I use the rotary feature only to view my fly and to get different angles when tying in materials. I learned to tie when rotary vises were just coming into the picture so I have a different perspective on what they should be used for.

 

Being somewhat obsessive compulsive, I feel I get better placement of materials when I wrap them manually. I have my LAW vise set up so the hook is at eye level. By doing this, I never have to lean forward, which saves my neck and back from unnecessary strain.

 

Just like most things, do what is comfortable to you. You will enjoy the activity much more as a result.

 

 

 

 

 

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Also, you're not getting much by going from the Traveller to the HMH. You will be much happier saving your money and getting your "dream vise". The LAW vises are a modern marvel. Probably, the finest workmanship (and functionality) that you will ever see in any vise.

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I don’t view the HMH as an upgrade but rather offering potential benefits that I don’t get from my traveler. Just as in your wonderful avatar of the Law, the HMH will allow me to angle the head (which I can’t do with the traveler) to have better access to the hook.. I have large hands it appears (maybe I’m wrong) that access would be dramatically improved. It looks like another good option would be the Renzetti Presenation 2000 which allows you to adjust the head angle just as is the case with the Master. The Law does look like a thing of beauty and one day when the dollar is a tad stronger I might just take the plunge. I am amazed at how much I enjoy the “tying” aspect of fly fishing…..much more than I ever would have thought.

 

Tom

 

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True. I didnt think of being able to adjust the HMH. Sorry.

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I use the rotary feature mostly for applying carded materials. I can keep the material on the card so I don't have to cut a chunk off. If I cut a chunk off I'm guessing as to how long it will last and I'll almost always end up with some scrap not long enough for most applications. I also own the traveler and love it. I do also see the beauty of the HMH because you can use it to apply materials as well as angle the head.

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Having the options of changing jaws and being able to adjust the angle of this vise makes it a win win. I'm with Alex on the point of when to use the rotary function. Most of us were taught tying the conventional way however there are great advantages to using that rotary function. If your looking into tying alot and wanting better access to the rear of the hook, make the move. Shouldn't have a problem selling the traveler, try the trading floor B)

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I have a Dyna-King that I use for larger flies and do use the rotary function to apply materials from time to time. I also bought an HMH Spartan with midge jaws for the same reason you are looking at it. I really like it for small flies as you have greater access to the hook in my opinion.

 

Just my .02 cents worth.

 

Dave

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I use the rotary function of my LAW all the time. I learned to tie on a Thompson A so looking at the far side of the hook required a mirror or loosening the c-clamp and pointing the vise in the other direction. Learning to use the rotary function was fairly seamless in my experience.

 

If you really want a LAW, save up for one, it will be worth the wait.

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Out of curiosity, is it possible to use rotary tying techniques to wrap hackle, ribbing, chenille, etc. on a "non-true rotary" vice like the HMH? How much difference does it make that the shank isn't perfectly in alignment? It doesn't seem that most true rotary vices keep very large or very small hook sizes in perfect alignment anyway (in my admittedly limited experience).

 

I think I like the traditional configuration of HMH, etc., but I also like to use rotary techniques (currently tie on a Peak, which is a nice vise btw)

 

And even though I think I like the traditional configuration better, I'd make an exception for the LAW vice.

 

Troutbum, Mama said "The LAW vice is de devil!" :j_k: (okay, Mama didn't say that, and it's not the devil. It just makes me want to take up a life of crime so I could afford one.)

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It doesn't seem that most true rotary vices keep very large or very small hook sizes in perfect alignment anyway (in my admittedly limited experience).

 

the renzetti vise heads have 3 holes to reposition the head for alignment between the hook axis and the vise axis

 

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I am also of the non-rotary(true) type, using a Dyna-King Kingfisher, which can be rotated for viewing. I wanted a simple solid vise. If I where tying alot more, than a Law would find it's way here or a DK cuda.....

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The idea has merit in some respects. I have a Traveler and a Dyna-King Supreme and the latter does have some distinct advantages, although mostly for large flies, not small ones.

 

That being said, you should probably keep in mind that as a novice tier, some of your problem may stem from inexperience rather than the shortcomings of your equipment. All is relative, but generally speaking a size 14 is not a small fly and I think you probably still need to develop your technique.

 

Regardless, the inline rotary feature is nice but not crucial to any vise. An HMH will hold the hook just as well.

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For those that have used both are there any functional benefits to the HMH Standard over the HMH Spartan? Thanks!

 

Tom

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