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Arkansas Mike

Regal Disaster

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With the number of Regals that seem to do this, I would say it is NOT a poor carpenter blaming his tools, but poor hardening of the jaws themselves (as in, intense hardening that isnt deep enough, resulting in a brittle structure). I have heard their customer service is decent, so I doubt it will be an issue, but for the cost of modern vises, i would simply expect better.

 

FWIW, i used one of the aforementioned sunrise vises (mine was 7 bucks) for 2 years, and now own 2 Thompson Model As. Total vise cost...30 bucks for all three. And oddly, i havent broken a jaw. :unsure:

 

Good luck, hope they get it straightened out quick for you!

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An "improperly" inserted hook should never ever break vice jaws

 

What is an improperly inserted hook?????????????? Fly vises are built to hold hooks, period. If they can't hold a hook, no matter how its inserted, or if parts of the vise break while doing the job it was intended for, that vise should not be on the market, period.

 

If a company does not stand behind its product, you definitely need another product and company.

 

In my experience, the quality companies in flytying and flyfishing, no matter the cost of their product, always stand behind their vises, and rods and reels. An example is TFO and its rods. You break it anyway in the world, and they replace it immediately. That's service. I haven't broken a vise, but the same should be true as much as many cost.

 

Ray

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Hi Mike,

 

I'm sorry if my post came across as harsh, but I've grown tired of posts that bash a good product when it's the user's fault. Just re-read what others wrote above in response. How many folks are going to read this thread and cross Regal right off the list as a vise they may want in the future since the jaws might chip. I've read many posts about the jaws spitting out hooks too over the years. They spit them out because the hook is too close to the tips of the jaws. I have yet to read one thread that states it spit a hook out while I was spinning hair, wrapping dubbing, or whip finishing off a fly. They include a drawing that shows what the proper placement of the hook is, and what's not the right way. If they didn't temper their jaws like a Sunrise vise, folks would complain about that. If the spring mechanism that makes the jaws hold the hook was too weak, they wouldn't still be in business either. It's one of the easiest vises to use for a huge range of hook sizes. You just have to insert the hook deep enough and that's it. I can't say that it will never happen to mine, but if it does, it's my fault for not paying close enough attention. Accidents happen, that's why their called accidents. It's just like blameing the fly rod that breaks when you slam the car door on it.

 

Regards,

Mark

 

 

No problem, Mark. :rolleyes:

 

Mike

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The instructions you got with your vise clearly states that improperly placed hooks will cause exactly what you said,an airborne hook and chipped jaws.The stainless jaws they also sell are guaranteed not to chip,no matter how the hook is placed.Sorry about your luck,but my first regal is over 20 yrs old and still going strong.

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What is an improperly inserted hook?????????????? Fly vises are built to hold hooks, period. If they can't hold a hook, no matter how its inserted, or if parts of the vise break while doing the job it was intended for, that vise should not be on the market, period.

 

My point exactly

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The instructions you got with your vise clearly states that improperly placed hooks will cause exactly what you said,an airborne hook and chipped jaws.

 

Didn't realize they built some of these dudes out of egg shell! I use HMH, Renzetti, and Nor-Vise. They are built of metal at least as strong as a hook.

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The constant-tension, no-adjustment feature of Regal is EXACTLY what has kept me from thinking about buying one. I have tied on them a couple of times, and found nothing that kept me from tying to the best of my ability, but the one-size-fits-all concept turns me off. I guess that's a problem with being a technician, I'm not happy unless I can fine tune whatever I'm working with. I've found over the years the vise should hold the hook just enough so that either the thread will break, or the hook will bend right before it slips. Any tighter is just extra stress. When I change hook sizes/types, I don't mind the extra 6 seconds it takes to adjust tension on a collet-type vise.

 

I sure hope Regal will send you a new set of jaws.

 

Now for the smart-a$$ remark: I've never heard of this happening to a Peak!! B)

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What is an improperly inserted hook?????????????? Fly vises are built to hold hooks, period. If they can't hold a hook, no matter how its inserted, or if parts of the vise break while doing the job it was intended for, that vise should not be on the market, period.
An improperly inserted hook is when the bend of the hook is placed in the vice jaws too close to the tip of the jaws, where the jaws actually aren't flat on the sides of the bend but a little behind it on the curve where the contact isn't sufficent; hence the flying hook & the jaws snap shut on themselves which may chip the jaw tips since they're always under a maximum amount of torque applying tension. Really small hooks make tying a bit more complicated without midge jaws as most will try to get more of the hook shank exposed to tie on, improperly inserting a hook too close to the jaw tips without Flip Focals ! :bugeyes:

 

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For what it is worth, I was tying a wet fly on a #8 hook. I'd tied in the tail, ribbing,

floss body, beard and was tying in the wings when it shot out. Like I say, I've tied hundreds

of flies using it, and had never had it happen before. I'm not going to say I didn't

have the hook improperly inserted, I guess I did, though I'm usually very careful.

What made it even a little worse is...I was sort of proud of the smooth floss body I'd just

wrapped. :o

 

 

Mike

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There is, obviously, an inherently poor design flaw in the Regal vise. No vise should have to come with a warning that catastrophic failure will occur if the hook is inserted improperly. That just sounds crazy to me and I wouldn't buy one if I knew that.

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It's funny that only Regal has a hook placement warning, as I've had flying hooks tying on Thompson models A & B, Anvil, Sunrise, Griffin & twice with the Regal. None of the others had any such notice, but the Anvil sent a #2 Mustad 3407 so far & fast that the only place it may have been was inside the drywall of a room wall, because the dozen at the fly fishing clubs fly tying night couldn't find it as it disappeared & vanished; just as if it were the #32 Mustad coming out of the Regal in a magicians stage show ! :blink:

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It's funny that only Regal has a hook placement warning, as I've had flying hooks tying on Thompson models A & B, Anvil, Sunrise, Griffin & twice with the Regal. None of the others had any such notice, but the Anvil sent a #2 Mustad 3407 so far & fast that the only place it may have been was inside the drywall of a room wall, because the dozen at the fly fishing clubs fly tying night couldn't find it as it disappeared & vanished; just as if it were the #32 Mustad coming out of the Regal in a magicians stage show ! :blink:

 

 

careful, you could put an eye out with that thing!!

 

I think my HMH came with a picture of "correct" hook placement. BUT it also came with instructions about adjusting the jaws to correct tension... to hold the hook just tight enough but not too tight.

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It's funny that only Regal has a hook placement warning [snip]

Key point. You can spit a hook and chip the jaws with ANY vise if the hook is not placed correctly. Don't believe me? Well feel free to experiment but the odds are good you will just end up chipping your jaws. For the record, have done this with a Regal and a Renzetti so far. The Regal is just more likely to do it because of the constant pressure...of course that constant pressure makes it easier and faster to load hooks and change hook sizes than any other vise out there. Probably the reason why this vise is so popular among production tiers.

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I was looking at buying a regal for larger ties, I have tied on one a few times and it seemed better for larger hooks (defined by me as greater then size 8) when I'm making streamers. Let me know how you make out with them.

 

In the meantime if you are out of business, shoot me a PM and I can load you my xuron or pamola.... if you like the regal, you will like the xuron as its just as simple but you set the tension.

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Bottom line, if you put hooks to close to the tips they will chip. Use the standard head for average to large hooks and get the midge jaws for small hooks. I have 2 Regals that I have used for over 15 years (personal, tying classes, loaners) and chipped one of the jaws way back when. Lesson learned. They replaced the jaws and the rest is history.

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