Cutting hackles....?

[Obi 0]

Hi evereybody,

 

I am new to the forum and started tying my own flies just a few months ago. So I am an absolute beginner I suppose, and this is my 1st, pretty general question to the forum......

 

I 'd like to know if it makes sense to cut down dry fly hackles to the right size, in particular when tying smaller flies?

 

The reason I ask is the following: I went after Grayling last fall, and I was using a tiny red tag pattern since the grayling are crazy after them. I tied red tags in hook-size 18 and 20. First time I had some few small hackles "in the right size" available. Caught a few nice graylings, but eventually lost the flies (indian-style fishing )

 

When I tied again 2nd time I ran out of small hackles and used larger ones, cutting the hackle fibers down to the correct size. Went fishing again the week after. Guess what happened - I had a lot of "near catches" all day long but could not hook a single grayling. Them graylings went after the fly, took it and spit it out at the instance.

 

So question to you guys - is it a mistake to cut down hackles in general? Would the fish feel the difference?

 

I know this is a pretty general question - however this will influence the success of my dry flies in the future.

 

Thanky in advance for your reply!

 

 

Take care,

 

Obi

[lykos33 0]

Obi, I'm sure the more knowledgable tiers/ fisherfolk will chime in ...but I have been told that you DO NOT trim the hackle on dries...except on the bottom to make the fly ride lower in the film. As far as the fish feeling the difference, I suppose they could have....or the hackle being a tad stiffer at the base (next to the stem)maybe it actually was harder for them to clamp down on?!?!?

Murray

[Piker20 0]

Did you mean you took a longer feather and cut away so much of the stem so you only tied in the top portion with hackles a similar size as the smaller feathers?

I have done this when the cape only has the long ones left on it but now I spend a wee bit more on my cape and the length of the hackle remains more constant over the whole cape. So if I'm winding a body hackle I would use the long feather for long shank hooks and short for short but the gape of the hackle remains fairly constant over the whole length. Hope this makes some sense. If you see the pic I borrowed from the net you can see what I mean. On the more pricey capes the ginger hackle in pic has a more consistant width over its length. In the cheaper ones I first used the width went from wide to narrow as the feather length goes longer.

[perchjerker 0]

I suspect that your problem stemmed directly from the cut hackle. Remember, the tips of the fibers are very thin and quite soft, but at the base, they are thicker and rather stiff. You can see this for yourself by taking a hackle feather of any size and running your finger along the tips of the fibers, and then cutting the fibers off closet to the quill and then run your fingers over the new 'tips'. You can feel the difference.

 

The mouth of a fish is very sensitive. It is this sensitivity that helps them discriminate between food items and non-food items. The fly with uncut hackle should be much softer in the mouth, and thus, feel more like a satisfactory food item; whereas, one with cut hackles would be expected to be somewhat 'prickly', and therefore, feel 'unnatural' and immediately rejected if they have been feeding on 'bugs' that don't have prickly, rigid body components like the legs on a grasshopper, etc.

[perchjerker 0]

I suspect that your problem stemmed directly from the cut hackle. Remember, the tips of the fibers are very thin and quite soft, but at the base, they are thicker and rather stiff. You can see this for yourself by taking a hackle feather of any size and running your finger along the tips of the fibers, and then cutting the fibers off closet to the quill and then run your fingers over the new 'tips'. You can feel the difference.

 

The mouth of a fish is very sensitive. It is this sensitivity that helps them discriminate between food items and non-food items. The fly with uncut hackle should be much softer in the mouth, and thus, feel more like a satisfactory food item; whereas, one with cut hackles would be expected to be somewhat 'prickly', and therefore, feel 'unnatural' and immediately rejected if they have been feeding on 'bugs' that don't have prickly, rigid body components like the legs on a grasshopper, etc.

[firedad 0]

This question has been asked here a few times before. We even went as far as testing the floatability of trimmed and un-trimmed hackles. The experiment proved that both floated the same for the same period of time. Also the consensus was that fish don't care it was more of a tier's preference of looks to not trim hackle. Finally we found there are many patterns that call for trimmed hackle (more than just the bottom).

[Will K 0]

I've done this a bit over the years if I did not have the size needed OR was feeling cheap with buying more hackles to have the correct size. That said, i've always done it on bigger flies like 10's, 12's, 14's... and not with small stuff like 18's and 20's and 22's etc. becuase of that, the fibers are still pretty soft, and maybe that's why it has worked for me.

 

Very often I do things like trim the top and bottom so hackles only extend from the sides.

[Obi 0]

Hi everybody,

 

thank you very much for your replies so far Good points there. Thinking back again I suppose part of my obsrevation was that the greylings had seen a lot of dryflies in different sizes and patterns, and it may be also true that they noticed the stiffer trimmed hackles.

 

I am now having enough small hackles on stock to tie some decent small patterns. I guess I learnt something and try to avoid trimming hackles on small patterns.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Obi