Clouser Deep Minnow for trout

[Obi 0]

Dear all,

 

I tied a set of Clouser Deep Minnows for pike-fishing over the week end. I did fairly good, except for the head finish. Did not manage to tye a cone-head-type head-finish, probably because I placed the hour-glass type 3D-eyes too close to the hook's eye. Still the minnows look pretty "catchie", and you learn with your mistakes, don't you?

 

Anyway - I did a lot of reading in the INet and found that the Clouser Minnow seams to bee the best thing since bread came sliced for catching any kind of fish species that will eat smaller fish. That's what they promise.... We will see - but I thought the pattern might work for trout as well, just a little smaller in size. Even if I did not find an appropriate material list, I suppse somebody here came to a similar conclusion as well. Probably you guys do have some hints for me? Would be just nice..... So here are my questions:...

 

What would be an appropriate hook size and type for trout-type clouser minnow?

 

What would be good color combinations?

 

What kind of 3D-eyes would you recommend to achieve a good sinking-rate and a jig-like movement of the minnow, but not over-weighing the fly at the same time?

 

Where should I place the eyes on the hook-shank to have enough space for the head-finish, but achieving appropriate action of the fly at the same time?

 

Appreciate your comments - thanks a lot upfront!

 

 

Take care,

 

 

Obi

[perchjerker 0]

Obi...

 

I would stick with the materials in the original; two colors of deer hair and some krystal flask, with one of the colors being white to represent the abdomen of a fish. The color for the 'back' should be that that resembles the local 'minnows' in the water you fish, as this is what you are trying to mimic. Most of my saltwater 'flats' fishermen buddies use various sizes of bead chain for the eyes, as quite often the grass beds are extremely thick and they want the fly to 'slide' over the top of the grass; not sink into it. Tie them on the hook about 1/4 -1/3 shank length behind the eye, to get a nice shaped head.

 

I create a small "saddle" of thread to seat them in. I attach the thread at the eye and wind back to just beyond where I want the eyes. I then advance the thread about five turns towards the hook eye, and then build up a small 'hump' of thread, after which I again advance the thread about five turns and build the front 'hump'; creating the "saddle". I place the stem between the two eyes in this saddle and bind down.

 

Good luck!

[tidewaterfly 0]

Obi, Clousers are a fly type I use a lot, and tie most of them with deer tail, as in the original. However, there are other materials that can be used & quite well for smaller sizes. Some of what I've used include ostrich herl, particularly black, as it makes a great leech imitation, Red fox, Arctic fox, Kit fox or Coyote tail hair, all being finer textured than most deer tail hair & are great for small flies. Finn Raccoon also works well. Body hair from foxes or coyotes also works.

 

Perchjerker summed up the eyes pretty well. Go with a variety to get different sink rates & for different depths. I use barbell eyes in lead, but have come to prefer the brass ones. Lead eyes have broken too many times for me. I also use bead chain quite a bit.

 

Hook sizes will also vary, and a variety is not a bad idea to have on hand. In the smaller sizes, like size 8, which is about as small as I usually go, I prefer longer shank, straight eye hooks, like a Daiichi 1750 or 1850, or Tiemco 9394 or 9395 style hooks. I've also tied small Clousers using Aberdeen style hooks for panfishing.

 

Here's some flies I've tied using some of these materials. These are larger size flies, like size 2 to 1/0, but you can see the texture of the hair is much finer than deer tail.

 

Coyote or Kit Fox tail hair, painted lead eyes

 

Not sure the hair type, painted lead eyes

 

Coyote or Kit Fox tail hair, painted brass eyes

 

Arctic Fox, painted lead eyes

 

Ostrich herl, black brass eyes

[Obi 0]

Hi everybody!

 

Guys, thank you so much for your replies so far. Lot of good advice and suggestions there

 

@perchjerker: The points about correct placement of the eyes amd tying a "saddle" are really good one. I was struggling so far with fixing the barebell-eyes tightly to the hook shank. They always moved to e certain extent - even superglue could not cure the problem.

 

@tidewaterfly: Nice minnows there, and a good variety of materials you suggest. I will go for some softer type of hair for the smaller version then! Also a good point about varying the weight to create different sink-rates. I am thzinking now of using bead-chain eyes, dip-paint (REVELL-paint) and then insert some lead-wire or tungsten putty into the beads to add some extra weight. Not sure if that will work, though. Keep you posted.....

 

One more thing - any suggestions on a feasible alternative to superglue? I glued the 3D-eyes on the hour-glass-weights with that, and the superglue left some ugly dull white spots around the edge of the eyes. That pretty much spoiled the glitter-effect

 

 

Take care,

 

Michael

[Gene L 0]

Thin head cement will penetrate deep and set the eyes. I'd suggest putting on a few X wraps over the eyes, then the head cement, then a few more, cement, and finish it up with cement. That should hold it.

 

CA glue will definitely turn white if you don't let it dry thoroughly before wetting it. You could also do the procedure above, but use CA on the first wrap, then cover it with thread and head cement.

[tidewaterfly 0]

I use a gel type super glue. It's thicker than regular CA's, and doesn't run as easily. I just put a small dab on the barbell with a tooth pick & an epoxy over coat on the eyes & head after the fly is tied. On small flies I'll sometimes coat the eyes & head with Sally Hansen Hard as Nails instead of epoxy. Not as durable, but easier to do.

[lykos33 0]

If you can find "Gorilla Super Glue" ( Home Depot for mine) try it. It comes in both liquid and gel and sets very fast and DOES NOT let go. I use it as a head cement and then overcoat with SH or some other cover all. It fills gaps well , penetrates well, and definitely holds like a pit bull

Murray

[Polarbear78 0]

I tie a clouser style minnow on Mustad 3366 size 6,8 and even 10 hooks for panfish so this might work well for the trout as well. I will have to try it this year! I tie the fly with bead chain eyes, and either 2 colors of buck tail and flash, or will even use one or two colors of marabou and flash.

[perchjerker 0]

Charlie Cypert, a well known Central Texas White Bass/Striper guide, now retired, and a commercial tier who supplied both the Dallas and Houston Orvis stores, and numerous others, with Clousers for years, taught me how to attach eyes without the use of CA that would NOT move.

 

He tied them on by the "10" formula: 10 of threadin each direction. He first did the 'standard' "Figure 8" tie; criss-crossing ("X") back and forth over the eyes and over the backof the 'bug', he then repeated the process UNDER the eyes. He next did the figure 8 from eye-to-eye over the top of the bug, and then again underneath; maintaining very good tension all the time. He would next make 10 turns around eye on one side of the head, and then cross the thread over, either on top or bottom, and make 10 turns around the base of the opposite eye. These turns were made in a plane parallel to the hook shank. He felt that this put sufficient pressure on all previous wraps that any slack, that would permit eye movement, had been eliminated. His final step was to whip finish.

 

He was so experienced at doing this that his hand was a blur when doing it; making it impossible for anyone for anyone to figure it out just by watching him, as it mostly all wrist movement. With a little practice, one can readily learn how to do it and can become quite proficient at it.

 

Give it a try; you might like it!

 

Cheers!

[Aqueous1025 0]

tidewaterfly, those are some pretty sweet looking C minows. Seeing your picture, I think I might try tying some up of your ideas to add to the collection. :-)

[FlyFishin'Jam 0]

perchjerker, very good point to build a 'shoulder' on the underneath of the eyes. I found mine would sometimes twist after some hammering, but now they don't go anywhere.

 

This video illustrates the technique.

 

http://epflies.com/videos/lead-eyes.html

[Obi 0]

Guys,

 

many thanks to everybody for your helpful replies Will try the 10-times wrapping-technique next time!

 

To me, adding just enough weight to achieve the jig-style movement, but not overeweighing the fly at the same time is still the major issue. It is crucial to get make the hook flip upside down. I think that bead-chain eyes might simpliy be too light to achieve that, don't you think?

 

What about using a jig-style hook in the size you would normally use for a Wooly Bugger? I did not find an appropriate brand/type of hook though, even if I did quite a bit of research in the net.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Obi

[Will K 0]

I like clouser's for trout. They can work great any time trout are eating little fish, and they really sink fast so fast currents and deep pools can be fished easily. I really like white under olive or white under yellow and olive (like a "Rays Fly" saltwater streamer).

 

With smaller hooks, sometimes tying them with bead chain eyes vs dumbbell eyes works better (I just realized your last post indicates you were thinking of this - yes, they work with bucktail maribou and squirrel in my experience...)

 

Worth a shot at least

Will

[perchjerker 0]

FlyFish'n Jam...

 

This is what Charlie taught me to do; but, Charlie also uses the "shoulder wrap" on top of the eyes, not just on the bottom. The video does not show the wraps made on each side of the head in the plane parallel to the head that Charlie also uses. The way Charlie does it eliminates the need for 'super-glue'. An application of head cement makes it impossible to move the eyes in any direction by hand.

 

Nice video!

 

Thanks