Bob's banger

[flytire 0]

popovics used plenty of epoxy for his surf candies so he should have had good glue for the bangers should he have chosen to to glue on the popper heads.

[flytire 0]

As far as length, I would go from in back of the hook eye to a point on the shank above the tip of the hook point.

 

wouldnt that length of cylinder interfer with hooking a fish??

[flytire 0]

http://www.saltwaterflies.com/bobsbanger_chart.jpg

 

why is this getting to be so hard???

[Peterjay 0]

PJ, these guys must be sleeping because I left it open for the classic, "even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now-n-then", and no one siezed the opportunity.

 

Kirk

 

I wasn't worried. The folks at MENSA aren't losing any sleep worrying about competition from this crew.

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Norm, true about the epoxy, evidently based on what AGN stated is that he purposefully didn't glue the head so he could replace them. I'm just not used to that concept down here not having really toothy fish like ya'll that chew up poppers.

 

Your question about the length of the body in combination with it hanging down half the diameter of the body is a good one. I was basing my advice on glueing the hook into the bottom of the head like a typical popper. However, your question does make me wonder if it would make a difference or not.

 

If the hookpoint is below the head and the hook bend is clear, it seems the fish would get stuck as the body came out through its lips on the hookset. In that great picture of the chartreuse Banger, it seems that even with the head way forward of the point that it is partially impeding the hook gape on that 34011 hook.

 

Now, that makes me wonder about the definition of hook gape. Is the hook gape the distance between the hook point and hook shank the entire length of the shank or just between the point and the shank back into the bend?

 

If I tie a single piece of very stiff wire or mono at the eye of the hook say where a weedguard would go and trimmed it to a length where it hung down even with the hook point, I would think that would prevent a hook set and it is no where near the hook point.

 

That question just got me thinking out loud, additional input is welcome.

 

Kirk

[flytire 0]

hook gape/gap is a vertical measurement between the hook point and shank

 

 

reread your statement i quoted above regarding the length of the foam

 

are you saying the length of the cylinder is from behind the eye to the point of the hook?

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Well, not down into the bend but on the shank to a point above the hook point.

Your question just made me wonder again as I've wondered this before but just never tested it out; does a long body on the shank, whether a hard body or soft material impede the hookset the same or more than a material that is shorter but hangs down even with or lower than the hook point. I wonder this as I always thought the length should not go on the shank longer than the hook point nor hang down and infringe on the hook gape. Then I began seeing the bugs of Charlie Brown (aka on WarmFly.com, Balsa Fly Rod Lures) that have a hard balsa body that extends well past the hook bend and takes up at least one third of the hook gape and he swears he catches fish. He sent me some but I have yet to try them.

 

Kirk

 

These are a couple that Charlie Made and sent me to paint for him.

 

[Chefben4 0]

PJ, these guys must be sleeping because I left it open for the classic, "even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now-n-then", and no one siezed the opportunity.

 

AGN, for size of head to hook I generally use the hook gap as a gauge use heads that are not larger in diamter than the hook gape. As far as length, I would go from in back of the hook eye to a point on the shank above the tip of the hook point. Maybe Bob didn't have any good glue for him to be worried about the head twisting. I don't think you would have that problem with the CA glue or even epoxy that we have today.

 

Kirk

 

Im not sleeping just working too much! Otherwise I wouldve been all over it!

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Ben, I was specifically thinking of you when I said that.

[AndrewP 0]

Well, not down into the bend but on the shank to a point above the hook point.

Your question just made me wonder again as I've wondered this before but just never tested it out; does a long body on the shank, whether a hard body or soft material impede the hookset the same or more than a material that is shorter but hangs down even with or lower than the hook point. I wonder this as I always thought the length should not go on the shank longer than the hook point nor hang down and infringe on the hook gape. Then I began seeing the bugs of Charlie Brown (aka on WarmFly.com, Balsa Fly Rod Lures) that have a hard balsa body that extends well past the hook bend and takes up at least one third of the hook gape and he swears he catches fish. He sent me some but I have yet to try them.

 

Kirk

 

These are a couple that Charlie Made and sent me to paint for him.

 

 

 

Kirk, I like this design a lot, and have in fact been playing with something very similar. I'm using the 60degree jig-hooks to get the eye below the body, and I'm trying to incorporate some weight (lead? BB?) in the back end of the body right behind the hook bend.

 

The idea is to see if you can mimic the Zara Spook somewhat .....

 

The other idea is to weigh the back-end of the fly even more so it sits almost vertical in the water with just a bit of body sticking straight up out of the water. Pop the line, and the fly/lure "slaps" the water, but doesn't move horizontally much. Bass guys do this where they want to create action, but not move the lure very much in order to keep it in a small strike window (in a pocket of lillypads, for instance).

 

 

AP

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Andrew, you have to check out my Rabid Dogs, go here http://onthevise.com/flies/rabid-dog-280 and check out the additional pictures and tying instructions.

These flies here are made by Charlie Brown, I merely painted these.

Now, if you want to see walk the dog but not on the surface, check out my Foxy Glider in the Water on my youtube channel.

I think there is an inherent problem with the size of the fly and floatation needed for a Zara. With these flies, even a floating line/leader sinks enough that when you strip, the fly dips down under. However, that has actually proven to be really productive as my Dogs, wobble and dart erratically when they dip and quickly pop back to the surface. They're actually more productive on the bass where I fish than when I fish a Zara. As for the Foxy Glider, it has amazing action but has to be fished kind of slow so, I'm waiting for the warmer months when I need to slow down before I fish those again.

 

Kirk

[agn54 0]

I got a chance to get out a bit today and test the banger. It sure does make a ruckus on the surface, and has great action, I can see why they are so effective. It actually dips below the surface really nicely. It's also not the easiest fly to cast in 20+ mph winds. I didn't have much luck on the fly today but I also didn't use it too much because of the horrible conditions. I did pretty well on reds and trout with plugs though so it was still a good day. I think i will try some with smaller heads next to see exactly how much of a difference the diameter size makes

[BuzFly 0]

Bobs Banger is an all time classic. Here is how it was explained to me by Bob and Dick

No Glue: The banger head is part of the system. It is ment to be interchangeable. Also if a fish gets hold of it, it will twist and not break the head. You can have a bunch of heads and put them in front of almost anything. You can swap colors or make a non popping fly into popper. Good way to use up crappy flies when the Blue Fish show up.

Hole Placement: Center of cylinder. Most common. Gives biggest pop. Bottom Third of Cylinder. Less popo but gives a great V-Wake. Easy to pick up off water with less commotion. Cupping of the face is not necessary.

Hook Length: Mustad 34011 or any long shank hook with ample gap. The original Mustad (9something something) is no longer made.

Cylinder Diameter: Must have ample gape clearance. To me, more than 1/2 the gape open.

Cylinder Length: Varies. I try for about 1/3 the hook shank or a little more.

Tail: Typically eztas and Bucktail no flash. The Bucktail is typically posted upwards to prevent fowling and I think it makes it last longer.

Head Dressing: Typically Mylar adhesive tape wrapped 1 1/2 or more times around cylinder and trimmed flush to the front of the head. Oversized contrasting eye. I like to make one of them cover the seam of the tape to help it from unwrapping. Glue on tape or eyes typically not necessary unless your tape has crappy adhesive on it.

 

Also, the Bobs Banger is also designed to be a simple fly to tie.

Bobs Banger was an offshoot of the Ca-Boom-Boom popper that used a cut cork perch float

 

Brad

[Jaybird 279 0]

I see that the hook is pushed thru dead center ...This does tend to interfere with the hook gap which is at least part of the reason for the long shank hook. Is there a specific reason for the hook being centered? Does it create more noise when done this way? It would be a little more durable because of less leverage but I always locate my popper bodies high on the hook shand but then glue is a needed which is not needed with this design.

You are missing the logic behind the banger. The head is loose so that it can be replaced, a necessity when you are fishing for blue fish or other toothy fish. The hole in the foam is centered to eliminate the need to glue the popper to the line and will freely rotate around the line. Bob has several detailed articles on how and why he tied it this way.

[Jaybird 279 0]

Sorry but i responded before reading BuzFly' remarks. They were right on. From what I was reading, it looked like someone was trying to tie a Banger using instructions for a Crease Fly. Don't get me wrong, I like Crease Flies, even use them for snook. And now that I learned how to use my glue gun, they are even easier to tie.