Jump to content
Fly Tying
Sign in to follow this  
1hook

Anyone tie with India/Chinese necks?

Recommended Posts

I bought a couple of India rooster necks. I'm from the era of fly tying where genetic capes and saddles is all I know. I decided to purchase a few of these necks because they were cheap and graded as "prime".

 

I picked them up in all the oddball colors that I don't have genetic capes in. I'm actually pleased with them. Sure they take two feathers for a nice hackle neck but they do work and with floatant they have done fine for me this year.

 

My favorite use is using them a long with a genetic. I have some patterns I use a genetic grizzly and an olive India cape. Makes a nice color combo.

 

I was just curious if anyone else dabbles in these any more?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm always on the lookout for good capes, but I just use them for streamer wings these days.

 

That used to be all we had for dry flies, though. They usually can tie 10's, 12's and 14's OK, but it's hard to get anything much smaller. That is also why many classic dry fly patterns call for 2 hackles, a la the Adams. It takes 2 feathers to get a nice full look.

 

The stripped hackle stems also make good quill bodies. Use some of the bigger feathers for that. I also still like to use barbs from Chinese/Indian capes for dry fly tails, as the genetic hackles are generally too short for my liking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a handful of nice natural Indian capes I purchased from a British company: Light and Dark Red Game, Cree, Honey, Coch-y-bondhu and Greenwells. I don't like to overwrap the collars on my dry flies so one Indian feather usually suffices. The stems are sometimes difficult to work with- a light hand and patience are required. But I do like the results.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I too like them for streamer wings, popper tails, and I use them for the wings on dries that call for hackle tips. Better than wasting a quality hackle for just the tips. Can't beat the price you find them in some shops $4 or so...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes I like then for streamers and dry fly wings, didn't think about the quill though. I often like the colors that India necks come in more than the colors that genetic stuff comes in. Just takes a little mor time to use. It is interesting about the color combo though, it sounds nice. Might have to try it.

 

 

Matt

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chinese capes are usually larger than India capes, so they work well for larger streamers & hackle on poppers & bass bugs. I like to keep some Cree or variant India necks in my collection, as they work great on Bonefish style flies, or Bendbacks. I don't fish for Bonefish, but there are patterns that also make a great crayfish for Smallmouths, and Bendbacks work well for many species. I like the looks of Cree or variant as a cheek over bucktail or other hair & of course the price of India capes is attractive for this type of tying where there's a good chance of losing quite a few flies. smile.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm a pre-genetic tyer and I always find myself digging through the bargain bin necks when I find one ...there are some treasures can be in there. Lot's of browns, gingers, and badgers, and a few variegated colors. You won't find the grizzlies and dun colors but you could go the dyeing option for some dun. I wish I could have found these bargains back in the day. Good India necks were running about $4-$8 bucks a pop in those days and those prices were top dollar (read expensive for the times). When I see them today for $3-4 I am compelled to buy!


You'll need to tune up your hackle pliers skills with these necks. #14 might only be 1 1/4 " long as compared to a genetic hackle which can be almost a foot long. A #20 could be 1/2 " long. Multiple hackle are required for most ties. Old habits don't die...even with the modern length of the genetic hackle I find myself cutting the genetic hackle and making the two hackle tie collars.


Too my eye anyway, the India necks just dress a nicer looking hackle collar than the modern saddle feather. Tying India hackles back to back gives a flare from the base of the wing you just can't get with the genetic saddle; and whether this has anything to do with catching more fish is certainly debatable.


Used to be able to tell a India neck from a Chinese neck by the way they were skinned out around the head. I wouldn't swear too that observation today. Chinese necks were generally bigger and had larger hackle sizes than the India capes.


I am currently in love with a $3 silver badger neck I rescued from the bargain bin and use it for tying the base collar on Gordon's fly the "Bumblepuppy". Those tiny brown neck hackles from the tip of the cape I use for stonefly tails. All my wet coachman's are collared with India rooster coachman brown hackles. Before I go the microfibbet route I search necks for tailing material when tying some of the vintage dries, if you find some good spade hackle your in the money.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a dozen that date back to the 70's. I was tying parachutes last night with a nice reddish-yellow cape.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I started tying (and for many years after,) Indian and Chinese necks were all we could find. I didn't discover genetic hackles until about 1975. Small growers of quality hackle had been around since the 1940s, but few were found out west. Metz hackles only became available in 1972, buy by then, I was tying no hackle patterns for floating flies. Once I started working in fly shops, I had access to these fine genetic necks and saddles. The Metz saddles from the early 1970s to the mid 1990s were some of the best "bugger" hackle ever grown. They have since been bread "down" into dry fly saddles, a great loss in my view.

 

I gradually built up a large inventory of both necks and saddles from Metz, Hoffman (now Whiting,) and a few others, starting in 1980. By 1995, I had given away all my Indian and Chinese necks. Now the only uses I find for these hackles is for streamer wings. There are good hackles from the Chinese necks for the salt water patterns and bass patterns I have started tying in the last year. I haven't started buying any full necks, yet, but I will have to soon as I begin to run out of the big neck hackles on all my old Metz, Spencer, and Hoffman necks.

 

Last week I was in one of my favorite fly shops, and was looking at Whiting HEN necks that had good quality hackle suitable for tying dry flies. These necks had hackle that was longer than any Indian neck with short web free barbs. I would have loved to have found necks like that when I started tying.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Chinese necks still form the majority of what I buy for hackling salmon flies. I don't have any Indian necks these days.

 

Some years ago I was asked about the Whiting's saddles I bought being very expensive. I pointed out that I buy them for specific patterns. As I was tying 500 + a month per size of those flies, they work out cheaper per fly than Indian and Chinese hackle. Unlike most, in those days, I could pick a saddle clean in under a year of using it. I know for many that one saddle is more than a lifetimes supply of that hackle.

 

If I need an unusual colour of hackle for just a small number of flies I wouldn't hesitate to get Indian or Chinese necks for it. I, like many, learned with those.

 

Cheers,

C.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a large bin full and add to it all the time, been using them since the late sixties. cross bred barn yard banty is a india type neck. India necks are basically a bantom chicken. I grow my own bantys too. great for streamers, poppers, nymphs, some drys and even steel head flies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I started tying I used Chinese and Indian capes and still get them when I get the chance but only when I can pick through a bin of them so I can pick out the ones that suit my needs. I use them for Streamer wings but mostly for Irish wets and Salmon flies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...