for anyone who likes to tie buzzers. underwater images.

[Piker20 0]

http://www.geocities.jp/suimenuka/kapyupa.htm

[mikechell 0]

Those are some GREAT pictures of buzzers and an emerger. I guess a "shuck" should actually be tied on the bottom?

[Piker20 0]

I've tied some with a scraggy wool bottom and not sure it made the fly but fish took it.

[Jokey 0]

Those are great photos. It almost looks to me as if some of those chironomids have a two tone look to them. The back half of the body seems either darker or lighter than the front. Maybe it is just a trick of the light in photos though.

 

J

[Piker20 0]

Yep they certainly appear two tone.

[SilverCreek 0]

Most midge emerger patterns are traditional "suspender patterns" that suspend the fly in a vertical orientation with the hook eye up and the bend down. This is the way a mayfly emergers by placing the thorax wing pads of of the nymph into the film and breaking through the film with the nymphal shuck trailing behind.

However, this is not how midge pupa orient themselves during emergence. They form a flattened "U" shape with the head and tail of the pupa in the film and the body hanging below. The image below is from the web site below and confims the "U" shaped.

http://www.geocities.jp/suimenuka/kapyupa.htm

The traditional suspender pattern cannot match the the hanging "U". See the video below at about 1 minute 35 seconds into the video to see the actual hanging pupa. Notice that the reflection in the mirror forms a characteristic oval appearance of the hanging pupa.

The only fly that I know of that can duplicate this appearance is the Roy Christie Avon Special Emerger or a variation of Roy's fly.

You can do a Google search for Roy's fly or click on Here to see the pattern.

You can click on Simplified Version to see an easier version that Roy has tied that should be very effective.

I do not fish midges much in the slow clear waters where this fly would make the difference. However, I think it would be deadly since most anglers do not know of this fly and it would be new to the fish.

 

[JoeBillingsley 0]

Tremendous pictures, Silver and Piker (sorry, Piker. I forgot that you started the thread with the pictures so I went back and edited this). Looking at Roy's simplified version, do you think an up-turned hook eye might be even better? I know Roy is big on sinking the tippet below the surface and just that minute angle difference could help it stay off the surface.

 

Joe

[Piker20 0]

In UK buzzers have almost mythology status for trout and I always think an artificial fly fails to be noticed because it

1) does no better than what's already out there

2) it is too fiddly to tie

 

Roys pattern looks simple enough to tie but looks like it requires a 'dry' approach. Most buzzers in UK are fished wet with very very slow movement through the water. Hopefully via wind tow but by slow steady draws of fly line if necessary.

 

I'm definitely going to copy this pattern for my own sessions when I am after targeting fish and not a numbers game.

[Bruce Norikane 0]

...

However, this is not how midge pupa orient themselves during emergence. They form a flattened "U" shape with the head and tail of the pupa in the film and the body hanging below. The image below is from the web site below and confims the "U" shaped.

...

The traditional suspender pattern cannot match the the hanging "U". See the video below at about 1 minute 35 seconds into the video to see the actual hanging pupa. Notice that the reflection in the mirror forms a characteristic oval appearance of the hanging pupa.

You can click on Simplified Version to see an easier version that Roy has tied that should be very effective.

 

Ralph Cutter, who created the Bugs of the Underworld series, once posted on a web forum and asked for a pattern that would match the inverted u shown in these photos and videos. As I recall, no one posted a pattern. In Silver's link to the simplified tie, Roy Christie mentions that his pattern is a response to Cutter.

 

The simplified Christie pattern looks fantastic. I've tried many patterns similar to Christie's simplified tie, and they are tough to use. In the #20 and smaller midges that I'm imitating, the whole fly usually floats horizontally on top of the film at first. After a bit, sometimes they flip down to the perfect U, but often they float on top until they sink. I've tried adding some translucent foam to make them float longer but not happy with the results. So I've not had much success with this concept.

 

Silver's photo has re-energized me, and I'm sure he's right. Even pressured fish haven't seen this fly.

 

Piker - thanks so much for this post. Those are a really extensive set of photos and show some things I've never seen before.

[Piker20 0]

Yeah I saw the pictures from a lot of years ago and thought it would interest some folk to see them.

 

I generally find a size 10 or 12 is happily taken by the fish when its chironomids' about. Even when the hatched fly is nearer 20 or smaller. Have you tried Roys fly in larger sizes and still had an issue?

 

Does anyone know if Roy is still with us to offer anymore input??

[McGnat 0]

My U midge.

 

[JoeBillingsley 0]

A couple of years ago I traded emails with him about his Easy Peasy USD Mayfly. Very nice man and extremely helpful. I don't know if he is still available.

Larger sizes could certainly help. I tied a couple last night in #18's but, as Bruce said, once the body broke the surface tension there wasn't enough CDC on the little fly to float the ends. I added a little tungsten thread in the middle of the fly to get it properly oriented when it would land on the water but that didn't help either. Poly yarn might help and I know a larger fly would make tying easier......

 

Joe

[Bruce Norikane 0]

Yeah I saw the pictures from a lot of years ago and thought it would interest some folk to see them.

 

I generally find a size 10 or 12 is happily taken by the fish when its chironomids' about. Even when the hatched fly is nearer 20 or smaller. Have you tried Roys fly in larger sizes and still had an issue?

 

Does anyone know if Roy is still with us to offer anymore input??

 

I haven't fished a larger size, but I'll tie some up. When I fish a midge hatch, I start with parachute emergers, Stuck in Shuck variations, Griffith's Gnat and Mole Flies. If the fish are picky, I usually drop a midge pupa a few inches under the surface.

 

When these don't work, that's when I try these experimental patterns. Some days, I go through a bunch of them. Probably should be working harder on presentation instead.

[Piker20 0]

Same here. I thought id cracked it with a small turkey biot bodied fly with a hackle to hold it like an umbrella. But end of season there were trout rolling over and over obviously taking something just under surface but couldn't see anything hatching and started doing the multi fly change thing, then you loose plot altogether. Haha

[sunsignarcher 0]

This fly with an up eye and the hook turn would do the trick, no?