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haziz

Whip Finish Direction?

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I wrap thread in the conventional direction, away from me, over the hook (clockwise when directly facing the hook eye). However when using a whip finish tool, I find it much easier to essentially whip finish in the opposite direction. Rotating the whip finish, towards me, over the hook. I am not sure if this would weaken my wraps slightly. If I try to whip finish in the same direction as my usual thread wraps, I find the trapped portion of the thread (the horizontal section of the thread in the upside down "4" shape) created by the whip finish tool to be very awkward in positioning.

I have tried practicing multiple times in the "correct" direction, but still struggle with it. Does it matter? Should I keep practicing, or just do it the way it comes naturally to me.

I find whip finishing by hand to be very awkward, so that is not the solution for me. I prefer to use a Matarreli style whip finish tool.

Thanks.

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Hmm...never ran across this one.

Personally...I would strongly recommend learning to whip finish in the same direction as you wrap the thread. It is that durability thing I'm big on for fishing flies. Practice on any hook you put in the vise rather than a fly you are tying. That will ease any stress on your part to b]get it just right as you learn.

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2 minutes ago, SalarMan said:

............ Practice on any hook you put in the vise rather than a fly you are tying. That will ease any stress on your part to b]get it just right as you learn.

I do practice on a bare hook tied into the vise, essentially doing 10-20 whip finish(es) on the bare hook, until the hook becomes "lumpy", then rinse and repeat. I am still struggling with the "proper" whip finish direction.

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I'm not sure I follow what you're doing.  If you're reversing the direction (clockwise to counter clockwise) then you're not whip finishing, you're unwrapping thread.  You might end up with some kind of knot, but it's not a whip finish "knot".

11 minutes ago, haziz said:

I do practice on a bare hook

If you are, indeed, practicing your method, you're only "getting better" at doing it wrong.  You need to stop, figure out how to whip finish properly, then practice THAT.

Where are you?  Someplace close to a fly shop, or a member, who can help you out?

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i think you want to whip finish in the same direction as you wrap your thread

 

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+1 same direction.

Some tyers prefer to wrap counterclockwise. Some Lefty's wrap clockwise coming toward you over the top. Maybe if you're more comfortable whip finishing counterclockwise you might prefer to tie that way.

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Hi keep the whip finish in the same direction as you wind your thread on the hook a tip that could help is leave a space between the hook eye say about 1/8" and limit your whip finish to two lots of three turns hope this helps. Remember to keep it simple and not over complicate your tying method the whip finish has to be durable !!       kind regards Steve

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Same direction. If it's not looking right when doing so, I'm wondering if it's more technique or placement that is the cause. Good luck. 

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If you apply CA head cement, does it matter which direction you whip finish?

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1 hour ago, skeet3t said:

If you apply CA head cement, does it matter which direction you whip finish?

If you apply CA head cement, and apply it soon enough,  you can get by with a half hitch or two, performed on the inside or the outside--no reason to trouble yourself with the whip finish.  I think you are overthinking this.  IF you do change direction to perform your whip finish, don't use more turns w than the t turns you used for the last thing you tied on...it's sort of a math thing. If you think about it carefully, you'll realize that  if  t - w <= 0, then your fly may fall apart as you complete your whip finish.    If you simply do not change directions in the first place,  you will always have t+w>0, and this should suffice as long as, in addition, you provide that t>0 and w>0.  I hope that this makes sense, and is suitably rigorous.

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56 minutes ago, Bill_729 said:

If you apply CA head cement, and apply it soon enough,  you can get by with a half hitch or two, performed on the inside or the outside--no reason to trouble yourself with the whip finish.  I think you are overthinking this.  IF you do change direction to perform your whip finish, don't use more turns w than the t turns you used for the last thing you tied on...it's sort of a math thing. If you think about it carefully, you'll realize that  if  t - w <= 0, then your fly may fall apart as you complete your whip finish.    If you simply do not change directions in the first place,  you will always have t+w>0, and this should suffice as long as, in addition, you provide that t>0 and w>0.  I hope that this makes sense, and is suitably rigorous.

Regarding your last sentence...not understood. CA glue requires being applied immediately or sooner.

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I think Ausies wind their flies backward 😁But it would be the whole fly, not just the whip finish.

You may want to just use half-hitches (in the same direction as the rest of your fly) then glue.

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1 hour ago, skeet3t said:

CA glue requires being applied immediately or sooner.

 

Where did you read that (not that it's not a good idea)?  You can create perfectly usable flies without a whip finish or head cement--but they may last longer with a whip finish and head cement.   People were obviously tying flies long before there was such a thing as a whip finish or CA glue, they just weren't using flash.

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2 hours ago, skeet3t said:

Regarding your last sentence...not understood.

Nut And Bolt (with Clipping Path) Royalty Free Stock ...

In an effort to give a concrete example:  Suppose you take a nut and a bolt and you place the nut on the end of the nut and turn it clockwise three times.  Then you take a hankerchief and with it, turn the nut counter-clockwise four times.  What will be the result?  That is more or less what is going on when you perform a whip finish in the "reverse" direction.   At least in the absence of friction.  YMMV.

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