Hungarian Partridge Sexism?

[haziz 0]

It looks like the Hungarian Partridge skin that Bearsden sent me is that of a female. I did not specify any preference in my order. I will be using it mainly for wet flies and North Country Spiders (AKA Soft Hackles) such as the Partridge and Orange.

Do the trout care, and why?

[flytire 0]

Since bears den does not advertise the skin as male or female, and shows a male skin on their site it’s hard to accuse them of sending you one

they also have no option to order female skins

they will happily replace the skin for a male. Just ask

i have been buying from them yor years and they always send me an email concerning anything regarding my order. If the male skin was out of stock they would let me know and give me an option

https://www.bearsden.com/product1888.html

post an actual photo of what they sent you

[haziz 0]

52 minutes ago, flytire said:

Since bears den does not advertise the skin as male or female, and shows a male skin on their site it’s hard to accuse them of sending you one

they also have no option to order female skins

they will happily replace the skin for a male. Just ask

i have been buying from them yor years and they always send me an email concerning anything regarding my order. If the male skin was out of stock they would let me know and give me an option

https://www.bearsden.com/product1888.html

post an actual photo of what they sent you

 

I already started tying from the skin, so I cannot, ethically, exchange it. I was just asking, in a slightly tongue in cheek manner, about the seeming preference for male skins. Some retailers even charge a little more for the male.

Is there a practical difference from a fly tying perspective? What is the reason for the preference for male Hungarian Partridge skins?

 

 

[Philly 0]

 Usually, the male has brighter colors and more distinct markings than a female bird, not just partridge.  It would make a difference in how a fly would look to human eyes.  Whether the trout care, I don't know.    I don't use partridge that much.  I use a lot of starling for my soft hackles.  The males have almost black and slightly iridescent plumage, females are a dull brown.  I think most starling skins that are dyed different colors are female skins as opposed to male skins.   There's a big difference in coloration between a cock pheasant and a hen bird that would have an impact on how the fly would look.  

[chugbug27 0]

1 hour ago, haziz said:

I already started tying from the skin, so I cannot, ethically, exchange it.

If you paid bearsden $50 for this:

and got a female / dingy tan / brown shouldered one instead, it's bearsden who owes you the apology, not vise versa. Use or no use. 

 

 

[Moshup 0]

^^. I’m with Chug bug on that !

[Mark Knapp 0]

29 minutes ago, Philly said:

 Usually, the male has brighter colors and more distinct markings than a female bird, not just partridge.  It would make a difference in how a fly would look to human eyes.  Whether the trout care, I don't know.    I don't use partridge that much.  I use a lot of starling for my soft hackles.  The males have almost black and slightly iridescent plumage, females are a dull brown.  I think most starling skins that are dyed different colors are female skins as opposed to male skins.   There's a big difference in coloration between a cock pheasant and a hen bird that would have an impact on how the fly would look.  

I think the same is true with partridge skins too but you can buy bright or dull skins in both male and female. I think the best are the bright male ones (the most contrast). I think that's what you are looking for in a partridge skin.

[Old Hat 0]

Male/Female is tyer's preference.  If fish could tell the difference, they would swim the other direction at the first site of a hook.  

[Mark Knapp 0]

2 hours ago, Old Hat said:

Male/Female is tyer's preference.  If fish could tell the difference, they would swim the other direction at the first site of a hook.  

It's not really the sex of the bird that's of concern, it's the color of the sex of the bird. I think.

Most times when we buy a bird we try to get a brightly colored one to get the best looking fly. Males seem to be brighter most times. It might make a difference to a fish. At least, that's what I think.

[flytire 0]

On 8/19/2020 at 2:11 PM, chugbug27 said:

If you paid bearsden $50 for this:

and got a female / dingy tan / brown shouldered one instead, it's bearsden who owes you the apology, not vise versa. Use or no use. 

thats probably a stock photo from hareline and is not representative of what the actual skin that was shipped

there could have been multiple skins on their peg board in the shop and all of them will be different

[cphubert 0]

Having the ability to grade and choose your material in person is the best reason to visit the fly shop or show. Online shopping is fine for most things but I don't like to buy hair, necks, and feathers for MSRP without looking at them first. I realize some tiers do not live within reasonable travel distance to a decent shop and have little choice, reminds me of  the old mail order days with herters or whomever waiting the 4-6 weeks and getting a mix  of good and not so good materials. All in all not much has changed except the shipping times.

[chugbug27 0]

1 minute ago, flytire said:

thats probably a stock photo ...

there could have been multiple skins on their peg board in the shop and all of them will be different

Absolutely. I just think that if they advertise with the male stock photo and want to send you a female, they should check with you first. Some people do seek out the female, yes. But I wouldn't even assume bearsden sells them to purchasers of that listing.

... Except now I see bearsden posts both a male and female on the one listing. 

https://www.bearsden.com/product1888.html

Adding this

I don't think that was the case a few days ago, but I might have missed it.  If I did, my apologies.

[flytire 0]

the original poster never posted a photo of what he received so we dont know what the hell he got

is the second photo at bears den a female or just a different color male skin. too many assumptions

still no option to order a female skin

[chugbug27 0]

56 minutes ago, cphubert said:

Having the ability to grade and choose your material in person is the best reason to visit the fly shop or show.

Maybe you're right. No substitute for that.

[cphubert 0]

On 8/19/2020 at 11:56 AM, haziz said:

Do the trout care, and why?

 The truth I believe is that we tie most flies to catch fishermen (to sell or appeal to the eye) Not stating one fly will always catch all the time but fish are opportunistic feeders, a balance of size, shape, color, and presentation and what they are feeding on. That is the joy and frustration of fishing.