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First stab at Materials...


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49 replies to this topic

#1 CasualAngler

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 05:34 PM

Hello!

I'm just starting out, & have been perusing through the Threads, looking at YT bids, & scanning various Online guides. Taking their advice, I gathered a Vice and some basic tools. Using some sewing thread and a bait hook, I've been practicing both wrapping & whip finishing.

Today I decided to take the plunge and pick up some basic Materials, following the suggestion of buying only what's necessary for the flies I'm interested in, which are some very basic, reverse hackle (Kebari) flies, both wet & dry.

Attached is a Photo of the buy... Comments are most appreciated!

Thanks!

Alan :)

Attached File  IMG_20180913_163743.jpg   213.15KB   3 downloads

#2 flytire

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 06:22 PM

This list of beginner tying materials is simply a list based on my 30+ years experience in fly tying. The list provided below is for a new tyer who wants to tie trout flies but can spill over to different genres of fly tying. It is a BASIC list. Could other items have appeared on the list? Of course they could but that's somebody elses list. Other tyers will add or subtract materials to their liking. So be it. Remember its a BASIC list of materials. It contains materials the can tie hundreds or even thousands of fly patterns.

This list is in no order of preference. This list is provided for your convenience and in no way requires you to buy all tying materials all at once or any materials for that matter. It is also a generic list of materials as I really don't have any preferences as to what brand of materials you buy.

Eventually you will need materials if you want to continue tying flies. The list may give you a head start as to what you might want to buy

Again, you do not have to buy the entire list all at once! 

Buy what you want when you need it!

1. Hooks (in different styles and sizes)
2. Thread (6/0 to start in black & white)
3. Pheasant Tail (center feathers when possible for the longest fibers)
4. Peacock Herl (eye feathers and strung herl)
5. Marabou (blood quills are better)
6. Deer hair
7. Elk hair
8. Buck tail (in different colors like red, yellow, or white)
9. Lead or non-lead wire (in different sizes)
10. Ribbing wire (silver, copper & gold)
11. Rooster Hackle (grizzly, brown, white & dun) A good option is an introduction pack
12. Hen neck or saddle (grizzly, brown, dun etc) (great for soft hackle & wings)
13. Hungarian Partridge Skin (great for soft hackles)
14. Dubbing dispenser of hares ear (various colors) & superfine dubbing for dry flies
15. Gray duck or goose wing feathers (used for wing cases)
16. Head cement
17. Tinsel and other flash materials (in assorted colors)
18. Calf tail (start with white, add colors when necessary)
19. Yarns & chenille (used for making bodies, both in assorted colors)
20. Floss (1 strand or 4 strand in assorted colors)
21. Strung hackle (practice wrapping hackle with this. cheap alternative to the pricey hackles)
22. Beads (not necessary to begin tying flies but if you really need them get them)

23. Turkey tail feathers (multiple uses)

Poor quality materials are destined to discourage beginner tiers and cause greater expense when the time comes to replace them. Buy the best you can.

Another recommendation seen on most forums is to pick out 5-10 that you want to learn how to tie. buy the materials provided in the recipes of those flies. these materials are now the building blocks for tying different fly patterns in the future.


Ignorance can be educated....

Crazy can be medicated....

But there's no cure for stupid


#3 flytire

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 06:29 PM

regarding the materials in your photo, theyre ok and should tie a bunch of flies

 

i would suggest a full hungarian partridge skin in the future. the bag you have will mostly contain garbage feathers with a few good ones thrown in


Ignorance can be educated....

Crazy can be medicated....

But there's no cure for stupid


#4 Poopdeck

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 06:58 PM

Only comment I have is get to tying. Once you realize the simplicity of fly tying you will wonder why you had all the trepidation.

#5 chugbug27

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 09:31 PM

Congrats on getting started. Looks like a decent variety of stuff for your initiation. It can be a bit daunting, and your choices are not bad at all. I hope you post your ties.
cb27

#6 chugbug27

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Posted 13 September 2018 - 10:07 PM

On hooks, you might try Umpqua's U- series 50 packs next time instead of Tiemco. You'll be surprised how fast you burn through those Tiemco 25 packs. Though others might differ, I can't distinguish any quality difference between Tiemco and Umpqua.
cb27

#7 J-Kno

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 01:02 AM

I've been using Dai-Riki hooks with much success but it is getting more difficult to find them at the shop I frequent most. I just started tying on Firehole hooks and LOVE them.. really sharp!



#8 flytire

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 05:49 AM

nothing wrong with mustad hooks. less expensive than most brands


Ignorance can be educated....

Crazy can be medicated....

But there's no cure for stupid


#9 rstaight

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 06:10 AM

Not going to say one brand over the other. I tie on several different ones. You will find what you prefer.

"Scholars have long known that fishing eventually turns men into philosophers.  Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to buy decent tackle on a philosopher's salary." - Patrick F. McManus


#10 Flicted

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 08:43 AM

I made the mistake of buying a kit about 40 years ago and although all the tools and materials were covered, they were very poor quality.  As others have said, it is difficult to create flies you can be proud of with crap materials.  It's also harder to learn some of the basic techniques using poor quality tools and materials. But with quality comes cost and that can make it difficult to get a good start.  

 

You are taking a good approach.  Find a fly you are interested in and get what you need to tie several of them.  Get your proportions right and work on your techniques.  I used to do at least a dozen of each fly I was learning.  The repetition really helps.  Then buy other materials as you branch out into different flies.  flytire gave a good list of materials but if you were to buy all of that in one visit to the fly shop, you'd better have a big paycheck to back it up. 

 

Opinions will be all over the place on hook brands and characteristics.  Develop your own opinions over time.

 

Lastly, start relatively easy and work your way into more advanced techniques.  I usually recommend a list like this to build confidence and capability. 

Wooly Worm, Wooly Bugger, Montana Nymph, Pheasant Tail Nymph, Gold Ribbed Hares Ear, Red Tag, Griffith's Gnat, Adams, Blue Winged Olive (Quill Wing), Elk Hair Caddis, Royal Coachman Streamer, Black Ghost Streamer

 

By the time you work through that list, you will have mastered thread tension, thread control, tail/hackle proportion, and most of the techniques you will need along the way.  Best thing is, you'll also have a pretty well-stocked fly box.  These classics represent most forage types and they catch fish.

 

One more thing to add.  You are lucky to have YouTube videos and internet forums at your disposal.  Make good use of them.  I learned by mimicking flies out of a catalog and by using library books and magazines.



#11 chugbug27

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 10:50 AM

I may have gone astray. I was just noticing the Tiemco hooks and thought that a new tier who chose Tiemco might want to know about the u series hooks. Look, the hook is your foundation, so I really do think whatever hook you tie on that suits your fancy and gets you inspired to tie is what you should use.
cb27

#12 Poopdeck

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 05:52 PM

Not to change direction of the thread but I have to politely and respectfully disagree with you flicted. I've been tying with "crap tools" for 30 plus years. For many many of those years I've been tying super large saltwater bucktails and teasers which put more stress on tools then tying trout flies. None of my tools have ever broke or failed to do what they do, which is really very little. Other then the vise the tools really can't be called tools. They are more closely nothing more then helping hands. High tolerances mean nothing, they do very little and they are under no stress or punishment. A quality (expensive) whip finisher (a fancy fly tying term for a snell knot) does not tie better, faster or longer then a "crappy" whip finisher. Same for bobbins (thread holder), bodkin (small diameter pointy thing) and scissors. Hackle pliers I can see a difference but I still have and occasionally use my kit hackle pliers.

Somebody on this site ties beautiful flies in his hand with nothing more then a roll of thread in his other hand. A good vise will make things a little more convenient but certainty does nothing to aid in tying museum quality flies.

Materials, I can agree with you. However, the materials pictured are not really benefited greatly by quality, from a beginners stand point.

#13 tjm

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 06:58 PM

I made my first bodkin from a dowel and a needle,  I made another  with a bottle cork handle and a smaller needle my whip finishers are the fancy ones, because they were the only two available when they first came out, but I hand whip as often as not. My vise is a Thompson A and there has never been a need for another, again I think it may have been the only one available in that time and place. I have two home made hackle pliers that serve the purpose. The materials clip on my vise was formerly a spring for something, the gallows and bobbin rest were made from a stiff piece of wire 30 years or so ago and still work. the Matarelli bobbin holder blends in with a half dozen India made bobbin holders. 

So I kinda agree the "name" tools are not required, may not even be desirable if cost is factored in, but this is about the materials.

 

I've always used Mustad hooks but think the others may work also. Some day I will run out of the old Mustads and find out.

 

The materials in the picture will tie a lot of usable flies and I'd have no problem using them,  flytire's list will cover tons of patterns. The kits are wasteful in the crap material most have;  but i don't see a kit in the picture, I see some thought applied to what is intended to be tied. Keep going like that, pick a pattern and acquire good or better materials to tie it after you do several dozen of that pattern pic another and repeat, soon you will have bins full of stuff you can't remember buying, like the rest of us.



#14 chugbug27

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 06:59 PM

@op
I also think the kebari flies are a cool tie to begin with.
cb27

#15 CasualAngler

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Posted 14 September 2018 - 09:18 PM

Hello!

Thanks for all of the replies! I appreciate all of the suggestions & encouragement; it means a lot. It's like being in a beginner class, with everyone offering their input, and where everything said has great value.

To answer some questions that came up, I bought a Basic tool kit & vise, and a Ceramic bobbin fromm the local outdoor store. Most of the Materials were also bought there & at the local Fly shop a couple of blocks away. Having a limited budget, I chose the smaller quantities of hackle instead of the larger ones, although those will be my next purchases to save up for. I also took the vise apart, took some emery paper & cleaned up the clamp lever, and lubed all pivots with synthetic grease. It works smooth, & grips the hook well.

The allure of having everything at hand to tie a particular fly brings up an interesting question... Looking on eBay, there are many listings for a bulk lot of fly tying materials (skins, hides, dubbing, thread, etc.). There are also interesting 'comments' regarding said Materials; "Smells like Formaldehyde". "Bought in the late 80's or early 90's. Some packages never opened".

So... do pheasant skins age or decay? Are unopened packages 20 + Years old still good?

Based on what kind of flies I'm interested in tying, buying new sounds like the best option. Sure, it'd be nice to have all that stuff, but I don't think I need it all right now.

Tool set & vise pictured below... Thanks again! :)

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