Danville Spider Web and Uni Trico

[ejcrist 0]

I'm interested in using these two threads to tie very small midges (22-26). I saw these threads only come in white, and according to the book "Modern Midges" it says you can use a permanent marker to color the thread before coating to seal in the color. I know this sounds like a dumb question but do you color it after you've tied your midge or do you color the thread before tying onto the hook? It just seems like it would be difficult to use a marker on something that small. I know Semperfli Nano Silk comes in different colors so I might go with that, but it'd be nice to only have to have a single spool and color it whatever color you wanted.

[Kimo 0]

Depends. Usually afterward.
I do 90% of my tying with the trico
and takes marker really well and is easy to apply.

[redietz 0]

The biggest problem I have with coloring the thread before tying it onto the hook is that if I color enough of a length of to tie the fly, and then shorten the amount of thread out so that I can actually tie the fly, the newly colored thread bleeds onto the spool if I don't let it dry thoroughly. Otherwise, it works fine; just run the side of the marker felt along the thread.

[flytire 0]

i color white thread just before making the head and tying off

 

you could also do it after you whip finish the head

 

you could just leave the head white

[Hatchet Jack 0]

i color white thread just before making the head and tying off

 

 

Ditto.

Those are teeny flies so I'd think it easier to apply the marker first.

Experiment & see what works for you.

[flytire 0]

try veeves 16/0 thread in different colors.

 

16/0 will tie down to the 22-26 sizes you mention

[ejcrist 0]

try veeves 16/0 thread in different colors.

 

16/0 will tie down to the 22-26 sizes you mention

You da man! That's exactly what I was looking for. J Stockard and most of the mail order places look like they have it for a reasonable price. That works for me. The Semperfli Nano Silk looks like it has about twice the breaking strength but it also costs about twice as much. The important thing for me was finding decent small diameter thread in the colors I use for midges because I've been tying #22's with 8/0, and it works but it builds up pretty fast. I think I'll still get a spool of the Uni Trico in case I need a color I don't have. I mostly use olive, black, white/cream, brown, gray, and red but with my luck I'll find a pattern I like that requires periwinkle or something.

 

"Modern Midges" talks about the sizes of threads to use and has some good guidelines about using 18/0 / 30 Denier but then later on it says 70 Denier works for some of the smaller patterns which is contradictory. Maybe I'm reading it wrong but I'd think 70 Denier would build up too fast if tying 24's and 26's. I'll have to re-read that part.

 

Anyway thanks for all the responses gents. Much appreciated.

[bellevue.chartreuse.trout 0]

...

[Philly 0]

I'll color my thread with permanent markers though I've never had it bleed on to the spool if I had to shorten the thread. If you let it dry for a minute or so before you start wrapping that should prevent the bleeding. Be careful if you use super glue to secure the wraps, I colored white thread yellow with a permanent marker and when I applied the super glue to secure it, it bled red. I've always used 10/0 or 12/0 thread for tying midges.

[flytire 0]

Maybe I'm reading it wrong but I'd think 70 Denier would build up too fast if tying 24's and 26's. I'll have to re-read that part.

 

Anyway thanks for all the responses gents. Much appreciated.

You'll never experience using thread by reading about it

 

Buy a spool of 70 denier and then determine if it will tie down to 26. I bet it will!

 

Secret = thread control. 67 wraps of thread is not necessary to tie off the head

[redietz 0]

If you let it dry for a minute or so before you start wrapping that should prevent the bleeding.

Yes, it does. The only problem is remembering to do so! I've ruined several spools of white.

 

The other thing is, if any of these midges are intended to be fished dry, make sure the markers you use are compatible with the floatant you use.

[ejcrist 0]

 

Maybe I'm reading it wrong but I'd think 70 Denier would build up too fast if tying 24's and 26's. I'll have to re-read that part.

 

Anyway thanks for all the responses gents. Much appreciated.

You'll never experience using thread by reading about it

 

Buy a spool of 70 denier and then determine if it will tie down to 26. I bet it will!

 

Secret = thread control. 67 wraps of thread is not necessary to tie off the head

 

I've been using 70 Denier for probably about half of the flies I've tied down to #18 and it worked well but have only used 8/0 for anything smaller. You might be right - I'll have to conduct a scientific experiment and give her a go just to see. One thing I like about the UTC Ultra in 70 is how it lays nice and flat with a counter-clockwise spin - great for smoothing out midge bodies before wrapping wire on the zebra midges. It just might work.

 

I actually ordered the Veevus 16/0 and the Semperfli GSP 18/0 in the colors I use most often. I've read on Front Range Anglers (http://frontrangeanglers.com/choosing-the-right-fly-tying-thread/) that the GSP is stronger but doesn't handle as well for general use. I figure the only way I'll find out is to try it. Even if I don't use the GSP regularly for midges I'll use it for something else.

[planettrout 0]

Boy am I glad I bought a bunch of this stuff...

 

 

 

PT/TB

[Bugsy 0]

Veevus markets 30 denier GSP which is the same size as the Power Silk 18/0 and offers the same or similar strength. The potential downside is it's only available in white. The upside is you get a much larger spool for half the price of Power Silk.

 

Veevus 16/0 is a great option for small patterns. It's constructed like two fine cords twisted together, so it does retain a rounder profile. Strong for its size but not near GSP.

 

Uni-Trico is a very fine multi filament thread that lays incredibly thin and flat on the shank, making buildup a nonissue. You can see the hook shank through a base layer. Not for the heavy handed tyer but strong enough for its intended job.

 

Danville Spiderweb has its use for some tyers, but it's not one I enjoy using. It's a single nylon filament, so fraying isn't a concern. But it remains round, has a bit too much "spring" for me and is relatively weak.

 

Just my opinion.

[ejcrist 0]

 

Maybe I'm reading it wrong but I'd think 70 Denier would build up too fast if tying 24's and 26's. I'll have to re-read that part.

 

Anyway thanks for all the responses gents. Much appreciated.

You'll never experience using thread by reading about it

 

Buy a spool of 70 denier and then determine if it will tie down to 26. I bet it will!

 

Secret = thread control. 67 wraps of thread is not necessary to tie off the head

 

flytire - You were right. I just tied a #22 Zebra Midge with UTC Ultra 70 Denier and it came out looking a lot better than the ones I tied using 8/0 Uni. Since the 70 Ultra lays a lot flatter, which is why I always used it for tying #16 zebra's, it doesn't bulk up much at all when I kept my wraps to a minimum. I really didn't think it would work all that well because I was assuming it was roughly equivalent to 6/0 Uni when looking at the charts that show what denier is approximately equal to in the aught measurements. I know they're not really comparable since they have different qualities, and most manufacturers sizes are subjective so I was using that as a starting point. Anyway, I'm really happy how well it worked. Tying anything smaller than 18 is all new to me so I'm venturing into new territory here but I wanted to make sure I have a good variety because me and my wife are heading up to Yellowstone at the end of August and I've read you should have a good supply of 20-26 midges when fishing a lot of the rivers and streams up there. Up till now sizes 16-18 worked best for me on stillwaters here in AZ so that's mostly what I tied. The other week I didn't catch anything at Lee's Ferry on attractor nymphs and #16 Zebra Midges but when I switched to my smallest (#18) Zebra's I started catching quite a few of them, but another guy was doing better than me and he was using #22 midges. Between that trip and reading a book I have on fly fishing Yellowstone that recommends 18-26 I figured I better learn how to tie the smaller versions.

 

Thanks for the suggestion - that was one of those eye-openers for me.