Question re spun and stacked deer hair

[Jhecht98 0]

A lot of great info on this site. I have a question for some of the advanced deer hair/bass bug folks. I have gotten reasonably proficient at tying decent looking bugs but have found at times particularly after a fly has gotten wet that the individual clumps are prone to turn on the hook shank. While the flies can be turned back into shape, and fish fine, Im wondering if there is a trick to get the hair tighter on the shank. I feel like I am tying close to the thread breaking strength. Do others use a drop of super glue at the base of each clump? Any ther tricks? Thanks for any advice.

[rockworm 0]

I will be interested in hearing comments from other members about the use of cement in deer body flies. (Some say "sacrilege!") I have found the best way to stabilize stacked or spun deer hair is the application of several very tight wraps of thread in front of the clump after packing it back. I also think it helps to lay down a layer of thread on the shank before you start.

[vicente 0]

That's what I do I use dap rapid fuse all purpose glue, locking each row down after you pack it with a half hitch is good practice too.

What kind of thread are you using? I use gsp as do I think most of the really good deer hair bug tyers I can't imagine breaking 210 gsp until long after it's cut through all of hair.

[BobHRAH 0]

What thread are you using? GSP (gel spun poly) is the strongest out there; you can really honk down on it Chris Helm used to put glue at the base of each clump after he packed it; if it was acceptable to him, it's acceptable to me. Might also try stacking all the hair, rather than spinning it. Pat Cohen does it this way. Also, be sure to use a packer of some sort; either a Brassie packer or Cohens' Fugly Packer. Have fun.

 

Thanks, Bob H

[ben bell 0]

i keep everything tight, use lots of half hitches, and after a good day of use just cut the hair off and ty another fly..you can spend too much time on this..just ty a new one..my hair bugs are plain James not pretty at all, so it doesn,t pain me to cut the old har off and redo it..if i can catch a few bass on one bug that,s good enough. oh, and i don,t ty for show or dough..lol. also don,t trash your old fireline..it,s great for tying hair bugs.

[Jhecht98 0]

Yes good point on the thread. I often use GSP but sometimes 100 on smaller flies. Im sure I am not near the breaking strength of the 210. It is a bit odd in that the flies seem pretty tight when first tied, but more prone to clumps twisting a bit after the fly has been soaked. Not a big deal but thought I would get opinions. Probably overthinking it. Thanks for the replies.

[caloosa bug 0]

A light coat of liquid fusion along the belly, after trimming, will help keep everything in line. It will also prolong the life of the fly.

[JSzymczyk 0]

there is no 100% right or wrong way to do it. I usually brush in some thinned home-made flexament on the "belly" of my deer hair bugs after they are finished. It soaks into the thread windings and all the way to the hook shank. I trim the belly of my deer hair flies very close to the hook shank to maximize clearance of the hook gap. It works for me. It has been a few decades since I had one of my flies come apart, but yes, they do get twisted sometimes while fighting a fish. No prob to just realign them.

[Mike West 0]

you received lots of good answers already . Ive been spinning deer hair for bass bags for 40 years.

Im not as good as Pat Cohen,SMF or The Cream and some others on here but I know what you are talking about.

There are a few ways to go about it but not all will agree.

 

OK think about it,you have to bond the hair to the hook shank some how and you are dealing with a smooth polished piece of metal.

I learned this years ago from tying popper bodies out of cork,foam and balsa wood.

I dont care what you do you can lay down a base of GSP,Flat Waxed Nylon...etc. coat it with what ever...

Epoxy, CA or Liquid Fusion and it wont bond to the hook shank well enough to solve the issue we are talking about here.

It will break free and spin on the hook shank. All of your materials will be glued to the base layer you put down solid as a rock but the base layer wont hold to the hook shank....following me?

 

What you need to do is go at the hook shank where you plan to spin or stack deer hair with a file or dremel tool and really ruff up that area. Then lay a really tight wrapped thread base down with what ever and soak it with a solid glue like epoxy or CA.

 

Im thinking in my head right now everything I need to tell you. Its three or four paragraphs long and Im too lazy to type it all out.

If youre really interested PM me and we will talk on the phone and I can explain this in 10 minutes to you.

[ben bell 0]

I tried the glues and UV but it looks like i,m throwing stones at the water..i tried preping and gluing different threads to the shank even fly line backing but i just don,t want to put the time in to prep the hook because it takes too much time to ty the fly anyway..after the first bass the perfect bug looks like something i tied..lol. google Steve Potter Diver and watch his video and count how many half-hitches he uses then double that number..lol.

[Bimini15 0]

Does this happen with non GSP threads as well?

[ben bell 0]

Bimini, i think it,s worse because nylon really absorbs water and relaxes(elongates), things get really loose..you can spin the whole body around the hook..i think most threads relax when wetted except wire.lol..i just had an idea..maybe soak the bobbin with the thread in a warm pan of water for a couple hours then ty the hairbug..the thread should be fully relaxed and make for a tighter fly..

[mikechell 0]

I'm going to chime in here ... but it's not with good advice. I've wanted to do deer hair creations since first seeing Cohen's Punk Rockers.

 

BUT ... No matter what I try, what I do, videos I watch ... When I start spinning a second batch of hair, the first batch starts spinning on the hook. If I try stacking, by the second or third batch, the rest starts spinning.

 

I've, pretty much, given up on it. It's not necessary for my fishing, and I'm fairly sure I'll never manage a Punk Rocker!

[ben bell 0]

Mike, google the video shaving brush fly by lee peddle..you don,t have to stack to make a really nice bug you can just spin and pack.

[Bimini15 0]

I was asking because I don’t do a lot of deer hair work, so I thought it was me when I had the same issue the last couple of bugs, which where tied with GSP.

 

Wondering if pulling the thread back towards the bend of the hook after advancing to the front of the last clump and using a drop of glue would help packing it tighter and make it stay better.

 

Your idea is also worth trying. Let us know.