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Wrapping double hackle on dry flies


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25 replies to this topic

#1 Jpm5107

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 05:47 PM

So I'm starting to tie flies with double hackle's in the patterns, like Mr. Rapidan and Adams, and need some help. When you wrap two hackles, what is the best way to do so? Together or separately? I've tried both ways and seem to have trouble either trapping hackle or it just doesn't look right. How many wraps do you normally do before the wings vs. after the wings when doing double hackles? 

 

Any tips are welcome...thanks!

 

-Jpm5107



#2 FIN-ITE 34

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 06:18 PM

Watch this Tightline Production of tying an Adams, which uses two hackles. I think the most important part of wrapping is to wiggle the second hackle into the first when wrapping.

Number of wraps for me depends on size of the fly and barb count of the hackle. Usually you will put a wrap or two more behind the wing than in front.

 

 



#3 Flat Rock native

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 06:44 PM

Recommeding that you check Ch 12. of Al and Gretchen Beatty's, ebook, available for instant download from Amazon for $4.99...

This covers a Royal Wullff with double hackle and a split wing.

I have tied for 25 years. This gem will pay for itself in material expenses quickly. If your time is valuable, it pays for all 4 of BT's, 2016-17 Books (free with Amazon Prime) the first day you spend on the vise. This is the type of book that tying instructor might use for a college credit P.E. course, we have those in Wyoming.

You can download a sample. I think you will find that you will rapidly be tying fine looking, well-proportioned flies. Innovative work arounds and substitute materials are discussed in a precise terms. It is a great adjunct to the tying videos. You can learn from the masters for the price of one cocktail or grande coffee. Wish you well. If you try this e-book, please let me know your impression.

I am now using the BT's book on Wonder Wings to teach myself patterns that were too intimidating before. It inspires confidence as you progess from easy starters to more involved processes. Old dogs can be taught new tricks in this pursuit we so much enjoy.Attached File  IMG_1963.JPG   40.6KB   1 downloads

ps... I downloaded all four of the most recent books. Feel like I just received $100 library UPGRADE for under $25.

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Buffalo, Wyoming

Established: Circa "Whenever you see anything I have, ... that you must buy!"

 


#4 Jaydub

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 07:23 PM

I learned a technique from Skip Morris years ago. Basically, you wrap the first hackle with the wraps spaced about the width of the hackle stem. When you wrap the second hackle, once you get it in the space created, it stays in that space as you wrap forward. If you've ever seen one of Skip's dry flies, you know his hackles are very neat and vertical. 



#5 Flat Rock native

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 09:39 PM

+1 on fin-ite and jaydub comments

Kenduardo's Lure & Fly

Buffalo, Wyoming

Established: Circa "Whenever you see anything I have, ... that you must buy!"

 


#6 phg

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Posted 04 March 2017 - 09:26 AM

I find it easiest to wrap both hackles at the same time.  As for how many wraps, half as many, more or less.  On a dry fly, I normally wrap twice behind the wing and 3 times in front.  With a doubled hackle, that becomes once behind and twice in front.  I find it works best to cut them off separately at the head.

 

Just remember that most of the double hackle flies were developed back in "the good old days" when Indian or Chinese capes were the norm.  It often took two hackles make the fly bushy enough to float properly.  With today's genetic hackles, with their higher barb count and stiffer barbs, I rarely wrap a double hackle anymore.  Instead, I select one of the many multi-colored hackles that are available today.  For example, brown and grizzly mixed can be approximated with either a barred ginger or a cree hackle.  



#7 Mogup

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Posted 04 March 2017 - 09:35 AM

phg you bring up a point that I had been wondering about. I have noticed that dry flies seemed to be more heavily hackled these days. I've seen some very bushy classics posted. I recently tied a Quill Gordon at my club and the fellow next to me asked why I used only one hackle. This was a long genetic hackle so I had more than enough wraps in to complete the fly though it did not have that heavy hackled look. Have times changed ?

#8 phg

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Posted 05 March 2017 - 12:17 PM

Man, the difference between the hackles we used in the 50's, 60's and 70's versus the hackles we have today is like night and day!  Since the swine-flu scare a few years back, it has become difficult to find Indian and Chinese capes, but there are a few still out there.  Get one of them and compare them to a modern genetic cape.  You'll wonder how anyone ever managed to tie a decent dry fly....

 

I can try to take some pictures, later today, to illustrate the difference.  I still have some of the old capes.  They make great streamer wings....



#9 Bob Sc

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Posted 05 March 2017 - 12:27 PM

On a traditional tie like an Adams, I wrap the 2 feathers seperate.  2 wraps behind and 3 in front of the wing.  On a parachute I wrap them as one, at the same time.

 

Different ways to do it. Whatever works best for you.

 

Bob



#10 Mogup

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Posted 05 March 2017 - 04:09 PM

Phg believe me I remember those days . I mention to tyers now and they have no idea how
good we have it now !

#11 Dave G.

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Posted 05 March 2017 - 04:28 PM

I have a couple of the old India Capes, good for tailing fibers maybe. Then again maybe not.


John 7:38 ESV  is about "Rivers of Living Water"


#12 Chris_NH

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Posted 05 March 2017 - 05:46 PM

I prefer to wrap them one at a time. I like densely hackled flies so I wrap the first one nice and tight then snake the second one in between.

#13 Troutenhosen

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Posted 06 March 2017 - 01:14 PM

I like one at a time, you ge way more control.  When wrapping the second hackle, sort of waver it back and forth as you go around the shank, it works its way in between the brbules of the first one.



#14 Jpm5107

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Posted 06 March 2017 - 04:29 PM

Thanks for the tips. I tried a few of the above methods and so far I think I've got wrapping two at once down. Flies have been turning out decent so far. I also like the single wrap, with leaving a space in between the wraps for the second feather. Although, I definitely need more practice with that method.



#15 flyty1

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Posted 08 March 2017 - 02:23 PM

+1 on phg's comments

 

Besides the wonderful quality of the genetic capes and saddles available today, I tie and fish almost

exclusively parachute patterns for my dry flies.  Among the advantages of the parachute style fly,

these can be tied with an oversize hackle and really don't require as much hackle as the radially

hackled conventional dry flies.  I have found that even the old India capes can work well for the

medium size patterns (sizes 12 to 18).

 

I have a few things that have helped me with tying parachute patterns:

 

I often use a fluorescent color for the post as a sight indicator.

I try to tie the hackle in so that some of the hackle stem becomes part of the post (for extra stiffness).

I wind the hackle from the top of the post to the bottom always winding counter-clockwise (keeps the hackle from un-winding when tying off).

Instead of trying to whip finish, I use multiple double half-hitches on the hook shank behind the eye (most beneficial on small flies).

 

Give these guidelines a try - they really have improved my tying and fishing!