VersiTip question

[andresere 0]

Question for everyone. I have an original Rio VersiTip system (not VersiTip II). Each of the 4 'heads' are 14.6M long. I really like the system, but the typical range that I cast at the loop to loop connector is always fouling the guides. Are these tips truly 'level'? I've looked at them and can't really see a belly or obvious difference in the line, front to back. My thought is to cut these down so as to get the loop to loop out of the guides and be able to use this line. When I bought it the system sold for right around $100, they are now around $180. I can just ditch the line, but I hate to do that if I can get a work around for it. I have taken care of the line as I do all of mine and there is nothing wrong with it. I just hate to give up on it as I think it's a good system. Any info would be much appreciated. Thanks in advance, Andy

[eastern fly 0]

I trimmed a few of mind back and had no problem.

 

Kevin

[Rocco 0]

More info needed.

 

What weight is the line and what is the rod rated for?

 

Are you using a single hand rod 9' or less? A full size spey rod -- 13' or more -- or even an 11' switch rod should handle a 14 head with tip and leader w/o the head ever getting into the guides.

 

The whole point of the Skagit system is to let the shooting line out of the tip top in order to use the full line weight of the head/tip etc. to develop the energy needed. The rod is not supposed go into deep working bends at the start as in overhead casting. It mainly just sustains line tension until powering the forward cast..

 

Rocco

[andresere 0]

It's a 5WT with a 5WT rod. This is just a normal trout line, not salmon or steelhead. Short distance casting the loop to loop is staying in the guides. I was just asking if I can cut the heads down.

[spiralspey 0]

I had that line in an 8 weight. My tips were tapered toward the tip, but I cut mine back to about 10 or 12 feet to make them cast a bit better. I used mine swinging for steelhead, so I kept the head outside the rod tip and the only time the loop to loop went through my guides was when I was landing a fish or reeling in. It was an ok line for swinging, but I would think in a 5 wt it would be a royal pain if you're making the shorter casts typically used for trout fishing, even if you cut them back. Unless you use the sink tips often I'd say try and sell the line and use the proceeds to buy a fully integrated line.

[tjm 0]

Let me get a better picture here, you are saying that basically you have 4 different lines each @48' long, I take it as sink tip and line combined, and this (x4) is loop-loop joined to (a)running line (b)backing?

or that the head plus any of the (10'?) tips add up to 48'?

Because I thought from catalog descriptions that that system had a weight forward line that looped to 10' tips? And I haven't seen one up close.

 

>I went and tried to find pictures or better description of what you have and "VersaTip" comes up with a variety of descriptions and no pictures, so I'm still confused.

Edited December 12, 2017 by tjm

[andresere 0]

When the the Versitip first came out, it was a WF(5,6,7,8)F line with a loop on the end. Had 4 tips, a floating, an intermediate, a T3 and a T6 sinking line. Each of those heads were 4.6 meters long. Now lake fishing with the system, as in a pontoon or tube, is no big deal because you are letting the line out way past the loop to loop. But river fishing and trying to use any of the tips on typical casts you would make while wading, the loop to loop almost always is in the guides while you are casting. I've tried to find info on whether or not the heads are level line. If they are, I wouldn't think that cutting them down would be a big issue. That way it would move the loop to loop farther out of the guides. I don't do long range casting for the rivers I fish.

 

I fat fingered the typing - the heads are only 4.6m (15f long). Sorry about that.

[whatfly 0]

Of course you can cut back the heads, but then you are relying on extra running line to make up the mass. I would be less worried about the missing taper than the line not being heavy enough to load the road. Something else you could try is to see if a Rio Versaleader or an Airflo Polyleader would serve. Both come in various lengths and sink rates (Rio 6-12', Airflo 5-10') and might solve your problem without cutting up your existing heads.

[andresere 0]

I think I've got this thing figured out. I don't have the documentation that came with it, but I'm pretty sure this is how this thing is set up. Using a micrometer, I compared the 'base line' (running line, I guess) to each of the heads. The base line is a complete WF5F line with a very sharp taper down to the loop connector. In the one picture you can see the base line on top with the floating tip under it. Hard to see, but they are very different diameters. So in essence, when you put any of the heads on the running line, you merely have a WF line that has a long level taper on the front (15ft). Each of the heads are completely level. There is no difference in diameter between their beginning and tip. So how to get that much crap to turn over right...... I'm going to try underlining a 6WT TFO 9' that I have. Then figure out what to do next (drop back 10 and punt, most likely lol).

[tjm 0]

 

I fat fingered the typing - the heads are only 4.6m (15f long). Sorry about that.

Aha, makes more sense to me now. In the short cast stream situation, I believe I would construct another tip to provide taper if needed or just use leader attached to the line. Would still have the long sink capability when needed.

I have never liked sink tips in the rivers I have tried them in, cross currents and under tow seem to grab the sinkers before I get a presentation and they make me work to hard to get the fly back to recast.

Now I'm waiting to see what the real fishers advise.

[tjm 0]

You posted the pics while I was typing; I would just tie a loop in the butt of a long leader and connect to the WF.

[andresere 0]

My reason for my insanity on this stupid line was two, actually. To be able to use it for shotgunning streamers, and lake fishing so that I would not have to pick all the line up off the water for casting. The lakes that I fish in around here you are seldom 'depth charging' if that makes sense. I've also done long leaders on a WF for streamers so that's still an option. I'm interested in seeing how this casts. I've never over or under lined a rod before. Worst case scenario, I'll post pictures when I get back from ICU having the streamer dug out.

[andresere 0]

That TFO 6W flips that line over like a boss. Considering you have all that weight plus a big wet streamer.......wow.

[spiralspey 0]

So what's the motivation behind putting the 5 wt line on a 6 wt rod? Each tip is considered part of the head, so using the tips shouldn't be over-lining the 5 wt. And that still doesn't solve the issue of the loop to loop connections going through your guides when making short casts.

[andresere 0]

Getting the line to turn over. The last time I cast this line on a 5W it was an abortion. Don't think it was the rod (Winston IM6 5W). I think this line when assembled is closer to a 6W. Add to that throwing heavy streamers and I think the 6W will allow me to use the 5W line. The loop to loop in the guides can be a rod specific issue as well - was reading on a bunch of forums about this same line and I'm not the only one that has had the issue with the original line. Someone suggested looking at guide diameters, including tip top. Makes sense when you compare different rods. Yeah I could just go buy all new line, but I'm curious as to whether this will work on the river or not. I have nothing to lose, it's colder than $hit outside, and it's probably not going to warm up anytime soon.