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WHAT THREADS CAN YOU USE
Posted 08 March 2012 - 06:32 PM
Posted 08 March 2012 - 07:03 PM
Posted 09 March 2012 - 03:49 AM
Just started tying and buying all the things I think I need. My wife has hundreds of spool of (non cotton) embrodery threads in hundreds of shades, The thread seems rather strong. 3/0 & 6/0. Can I use this resources for my thread needs?
Posted 09 March 2012 - 03:56 AM
Thanks for the help. I never thought about them being too heavy. I guess I now get to start my own thread collecction.
Ok, 3/0 and 6/0 threads are good for big flies like streamers etc. I would use 8/0 and below for my dries, nymphs. If you can, head over to your local fly shop and they can help you..
Posted 09 March 2012 - 05:46 AM
overhand knot weave but never as a tying thread. Unless you separated the four to six strands
the thread would be way too big to use. Even then I wouldn't recommend it. Fly tying thread is
relatively cheap. Cabela's lists Ultra Thread for $1.49 and Uni-Thread is a bit more at $2.89.
You only need one or two colors to start out.
Posted 09 March 2012 - 10:00 AM
Unless your using the thread to form the body of the pattern, it shouldn't show except at the head. To get started, you should get white, or very light colored thread. You can use markers to darken heads if necessary. I have about 15 different markers just for that purpose.
Posted 09 March 2012 - 10:42 AM
Let me play the Devil's Advocate to your response.
Your point about denier is well made; but I am personally quite skeptical about it's accuracy between thread manufacturers, or batches within a given manufacturer. I can envision as much variability in it as you infer exists in the 'Ought' system. The kind of variability I can envision is not different from that of getting a precise color match between dyed batches of yarn, for example. As I am sure you are aware, Denier is a weight-based number for a specific length of the given material. Thus, this sizing system, particularly in the case of synthetics, is dependent upon the absolute uniformity of each 'batch' of the product produced. It is just as easy, at least for me, to envision similar vagaries in threads made from natural materials.
In other words, there is no single "Standard" for the denier of a given material that one can check a sample against. Each batch ("run") is it's own standard! I see this situation as being no better than the "Standard" for the "ought" system, which was based on single strands of silk, as I recall.
And I won't venture off into the TEX sizing system!
As far as I am personally concerned, there is no advantage to the Denier system for the fly tier. In fact, it is a hindrance until such time as I can get the "Ought" system Denier equivalents straight in my own mind!
Posted 26 March 2012 - 10:47 AM
Most people suggest 8/0 Uni for most everything, going to 6/0 for hoppers and small streamers, then 3/0 for huge stuff and bass bugs. This seems pretty reliable. It all deends on preference. If you have a bit of a heavy hand, use 6/0 to start. I use cheap Gander Mtn. 210 denier and can keep heads small enough down to a size 16 dry.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -Edmund Burke
Posted 26 March 2012 - 11:52 AM
Posted 26 March 2012 - 02:56 PM
You have a fundamentally good point; however, as readily available flytying threads are either polyester or nylon, any name-brand thread made of these materials should work just fine. For example, UNI is polyester, and is widely, and highly, recommended for making furled leaders. I have been using GŁtermann threads for over three years now for my furled leaders, and see absolutely no difference in the quality of such leaders and the one's made using UNI thread. I use their thread equivalents to UNI 3/0, 6/0, and 8/0. It is a whole lot cheaper, and I can get it on 5,000 meter spools(that's about 5500 yards) for about $12.00 per spool, plus S&H! Unfortunately, except for their UNI 3/o equivalent, GŁtermann threads are not readily available locally. Their UNI 3/0 equivalent,their "SEW ALL", is to be found in all Joann's Fabrics and Crafts, and comes in a myriad of colors. Occasionally, one can also find their silk thread in a larger Joann's than their typical store.
Posted 27 March 2012 - 11:18 AM
I suggest starting with the UTC brand of threads because it is a flat thread that allows you to control the amount of twist in the thread; and it just about universally available. A flat thread minimizes tying bulk. Whatever thread you choose, stay with a certain brand initially to learn the characteristics of the thread.
Scott Sanchez's article is interesting because of the comments of the famous tiers at the end. Each has their own favorite thread, much like we have our favorite fly rods. Use the rod or thread enough and it becomes second nature. Marve Nolte said it best: He likes his thread because, "The stretch in the nylon tells him when to back off to prevent breakage, and he knows exactly how much room a few wraps takes."
Frontrangeanglers.com - Choosing the Right Thread
http://cdflyfishers....n of denier.pdf
Here are two thread charts form the articles above.
"Discovery consists of seeing what everybody has seen and thinking what nobody has thought"..........Szent-Gyorgy
Posted 27 March 2012 - 01:41 PM
My advice would be to use and buy tying thread. They are stronger than sewing thread or embroidery floss, they are consistent in diameter and color, and they are relatively cheap.
This is not necessarily true! The Gütermann threads are, in fact, sewing threads, and their equivalent to UNI 8/0 has a tensile strength of 14oz vs 15oz for the UNI, and the Gütermann equivalent to the UNI 6/0 has a tensile strength of 25oz vs 29oz for the UNI. These variations are no greater than those listed by Helm vs Sanchez FOR THE SAME THREAD, as given in the two charts attached to your post; e.g., 15oz for 8/0 by Helm and 160z by Sanchez, and,29oz by Helm for the 6/0 and 33oz by Sanchez. In both examples they differ by 1 oz for the 8/0 (14oz vs 15oz vs 16oz) and by 4 oz for the 6/0 (25oz vs 29oz vs 33oz) based on my own calculations for the Gütermann threads. My "equivalency" is based strictly on the TEX and Diameters of the two different brands of thread (there is a direct mathematical correlation between TEX and denier, making the use of TEX perfectly legit.)
The color of the Gütermann threads is as consistent as in any other brand I have ever seen. Without having 'miced' any, I would venture to say the same is true for their diameter. I have passed several hundred yards of their threads through my fingertips while doing layouts for furled leaders (I use a standard tying bobbin for this), and like to think I can detect some pretty small variations this way.