Should I Upgrade My Vise?

[Randyflycaster 0]

Right now I'm tying on a Griffin 3AR Superior vise. I'm thinking of upgrading to a full rotary Dyna-King Trekker, which can easily handle saltwater flies.

 

I'm not sure, however, why spending the bucks would be justified. I mean, how much of a benefit would tying on the Dyna-King be?

 

Thanks,

 

Randy

 

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[flytire 0]

are you tying saltwater flies now or in the future? if not why change

 

the hook capacity is size 32 to 3/0. are you tying on bigger hooks??

[flysmallie 0]

I see very little benefit from one vice to another. Maybe if you are a production tier but other than that it's just money spent. I have a different Griffin with the same jaws. Would I like to have a prettier vice? Sure, but the griffin does exactly what I need it to do so why change.

[Randyflycaster 0]

I'm tying saltwater flies now, usually about size 2/0. I keep hearing that a true rotary vise is a big plus.

 

Randy

[Bryon Anderson 0]

True-rotary has two advantages over just plain rotary (a vise that rotates but doesn't keep the hook shank parallel to the axis of rotation) or stationary vises:

 

1) the true rotary can be used to apply "stranded" materials like chenille, or to palmer hackle, much more quickly than with the other types of vises, because you can hold the material stationary and rotate the vise (and thus the hook) to apply your material. Not only is this faster, it also allows you to keep your wraps and the spaces between them (if any) nice and even and uniform.

 

2) the true rotary allows you to rotate the fly and observe it from any side while keeping the hook shank parallel to your tying surface. This is very handy when you want to tie something onto the botttom of the hook like a beard hackle, or onto the opposite side of the hook shank.

 

Even having said the above, I can't think of anything you can do on a true rotary that you simply can't do on the other types of vises--sometimes the true rotary just makes things a little easier. In fact, given that very elaborate flies were once tied with the hook held in the tier's hand, you could make an argument that one doesn't "need" any vise.

 

As long as a vise holds the hook steady while you wrap things on the hook, it's doing all you "need" it to do. How far beyond that basic function you want to go is just a matter of personal preference.

[Randyflycaster 0]

Thanks so much for the replies. What about wrapping hackle that is not palmered? Will a true rotary make that easier? Also what about wrapping dubbing?

 

When it comes to saltwater and bass flies I often tie in hair on the bottom of the hook.

 

Randy

[Steven Wiersma 0]

"Honey, its not because I want it, its because I need it." Practice until you can say it easily, without gagging. Roses help.

[flytire 0]

i have a renzetti traveler. i used the rotary function when i first got the vise in the late 80's. now i just dont bother using the rotary function and find i stll can wrap a hackle without it. nothing earth shattering about wrapping hackles ribbing, dubbing etc. its not that hard.

 

if YOU think its going to improve your style of fly tying then go to a fly shop and tie on their demo vises. buy the one that best suits you.

[Piker20 0]

Would I TRUE rotary vice make you a better tier? NO.

does it make tying some flies easier, I find it does.

I spent some cash and brought a Jvice which I hope will last me many many years.

If you have money spare then you won't regret buying one but it certainly isn't needed.

[Old Hat 0]

The deal with true rotary vises are they are great if you tie rotary style. The truth is, I would guess, that 90% or more of tiers who use a true rotary vise use it only to look at the fly or maybe access a tie on spot. They do not use the true rotary feature for what it was intended even though the thought was there from the beginning. Not a knock, just the way it is. Both the vises you mention are great vises, however I don't think you will gain anything by dropping the bucks on the dyna-king unless you just want a change and that's OK too. I wanted to learn to tie rotary a couple years ago and make premade dubbing strands. I am still learning the nuances of tying rotary. It takes time and is a great skill once you have mastered it. It can be a very productive method. I don't tie rotary all the time. Only for specific patterns or purposes. I use another vise for most of my tying. I will say, you can call it a plug if you like, but I have no connection, I have bought and sold quite few true rotary vises to find the one that works best for true rotary tying. If you want to truly learn to tie rotary style there is not a better vise than a Norvise for that application. It is specific to this style of tying though and is not my favorite for just tying on.

[utyer 0]

The 3ARP Griffin vise is nearly a true rotational vise. The jaws do rotate, and the shaft that attaches the head to the base can be adjusted to put the head in a horizontal position. With the jaws in the horizontal position, the center of rotation would be the point of the vise jaws.

 

True your hook will be slightly off the center or rotation, the bigger the hook, the farther off it will be. However, you could still wind hackle and other materials with the hooks in the horizontal position. It takes a little tension adjustment as the hook rotates, but nothing you can't accomplish.

 

I use a Nor-vise, and the standard jaws will rotate in what is termed "true rotation." On this vise, the center of rotation is the top edge of the jaws. Hooks placed in the vise with the shank aligned with the top edge of the jaws will rotate around the center of rotation with very little or no wobble.

 

Even with my vise, I find that larger hooks placed in with the shank slightly above the center of rotation will still rotate with the shank in the same horizontal orientation, but with a bit more wobble. I can still wind hackle and material on the hooks.

 

On the Dyna-King Trekker (and other models,) The center of rotation is the center of the horizontal portion of the vise shaft. The jaws are on a different shaft. This shaft has a clamp and slide that allows you to adjust the jaws so that no matter what size hook is placed in the jaws, you can align the hook shank with the center of rotation.

 

My old Dyna-king Sidewinder, uses a adjustment screw and lock system to position the the hook to keep the shank at the center of rotation. The Nor-vise fine point jaws also work in a similar way to keep the hook shaft at the center of rotation. The fine point jaws can be moved on a hinged arm to align with an alignment pin. The fine point jaws on the Nor-vise are usually used with very small hooks,

 

If I were not able to use my Nor-vise, the Dyna-king would be the only other vise I would consider. Fortunately, I already have a Dyna-King. Either or both vises will outlast me. There a lot of nice vises I haven't owned, but I make it a point to try new ones whenever I can. So far I haven't come across any other vise that would make me sell off what I have a switch.

 

The Dyna-King vises are tank tough, and built for a lifetime of tying. The Trekker will be going strong long after your done tying.

 

One thing I will say, no matter which vise you end up with, consider where it is made. There are many GREAT vises made right here is the US, and some very good vises from Europe, and South Africa. Any and all of these will be a lifetime investment in a quality tool. I can't say the same for vises I have seen from various Asian countries.

[Randyflycaster 0]

Folks,

 

Thanks for making this a great thread.

 

As it turns out, yesterday I went down "just" to look at vises and I ended up buying the Dyna-King Trekker. I don't know if I did the right thing - I'm still haven't taken the vise out of the box -, but life doesn't go on forever, and right now I love fly tying, salt and freshwater..

 

(Perhaps I'll still find a use for my Griffen.)

 

I also ordered Al Beatty's book on rotary fly tying.

 

Randy

[mikechell 0]

Right now I'm tying on a Griffin 3AR Superior vise. I'm thinking of upgrading to a full rotary Dyna-King Trekker, which can easily handle saltwater flies.

 

I'm not sure, however, why spending the bucks would be justified. I mean, how much of a benefit would tying on the Dyna-King be?

 

Thanks,

 

Randy

 

.

I am still tying on the same cheap vise that came with a kit I got 20+ years ago. It still holds any size hook I tie on.

 

Buying a "new" vice isn't about better flies ... it's about buying a new vice. If you're tying production numbers for sale, then maybe a rotary or other fancy option vice will make that easier. If you're tying fro yourself, I doubt it'll make any difference other than you can say "Look at my new toy!"

 

Sorry, I see so many people spending tons of money on stuff that just isn't necessary for fishing or tying enjoyment. Keeping up with the Jones ... that's the saying.

 

If you've got money burning holes in your pockets, go buy a new vice. If you can tie the flies you want on the vice you've got ... keep it.

[imx 0]

I've got the bottom of the line regal, had it for about 25 yrs and the reason I'd want a rotary is to access some different points of the fly... I've learned to deal with it and I don't think it has effected my flies and certainly not my enjoyment of tying..

spending the coin on another vise has crossed my mind but then I could buy another or reel and a ton more different materials for what a high end vise runs..

 

But then again it's your denari

[McGnat 0]

Enjoy your new vise. Looks like a quality purchase. Life is short.