Dasco 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2018 Not sure I fully understand the use of the three Support Arms (15, 30 and 45) on the Norvise Fine Point Jaws. I can see that by using the smallest it will reduce vibration but what about the remaining two. How do others use them? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikechell 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2018 I don't use them ... not a Norvise owner ... but I can see the "point". The greater the angle, the more the vise is "out of the way". Although I don't tie small enough to have problems with this, I do understand the desire. If your 28 hook is held from below, instead of behind, then you have access to the entire curve of the hook. You might not tie anything there, but being able to see what's going on there might be critical to a well tied fly. Just my opinion on it. And welcome to the site, Dasco. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cphubert 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2018 Not sure I have a older set of NorVise fine point jaws and never had a need to change angels that I know of. I do not tie much smaller than 20's. I use the standard jaws for 12's and larger. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dasco 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2018 Thanks for your replies! I know understand the difference between the three support arms. What I can't fathom out, is in what situations would these be used. Can anyone give me examples of which flies are tied with each of the arms? Thank you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dasco 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2018 ..... I now understand..... Apologies for the spelling. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bugsy 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2018 Norm brought out the revised fine point jaw conversion about five years ago. The advertised reason is to reduce the slight wobble of the offset jaws by bringing the mass closer to the rotational axis. The 15 degree arm puts the jaw at the lowest angle and theoretically brings the performance closer to that of the inline jaws (which have no noticeable wobble). If that angle provides you with ample working room at the bend of a smaller hook (as Mike states), then that would supposedly be your best choice as you'd reduce wobble while gaining some working room. If you're crowded at the bend, move to the next arm for a 30 degree angle, and so on. In reality, I think most tyers will notice wobble with each arm. The problem is that when you have the jaws at the lowest angle, the easier it is to nudge the tips of the jaws unintentionally (due to increased leverage), causing the shank to become off center. That is, accidentally moving the hinge just a couple degrees when using the 15 degree arm will cause the jaw tips to travel further away from the center than when using the 45 degree arm. It's easy to understand, but I'm making a mess of my explanation. Sorry. For anyone that has the previous version of the fine point jaws in addition to the standard inline jaws, a little reassembly will give you an idea. Here is the previous jaw conversion attached to its own hub: And here is the same jaw configured to fit in the standard front hub: I believe cost of materials may have been an incentive for the redesign. The old jaws included a set of machined front and rear brass hubs, and these are a bit costly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dasco 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2018 Hi Bugsy - Thank you for your detailed and comprehensive explanation. After posting on other forums, and speaking with so-called experts, this is by far the best answer I’ve had yet. I now have a much better understanding of the potential of the jaws and grateful for you reply. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bugsy 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2018 Thanks for your reply, Dasco. I'm glad you could understand my ramble. I'm sure a few here are thinking what is that guy trying to say?? BTW, I haven't used the fine point jaws for that many flies, and it's been a while since I have. Like cphubert, I do fine with the small inline jaws to #12-14 and have gone smaller. I did try the large rear hub with the fine point jaws for greater centered mass, and that did reduce wobble a bit. I believe I got that idea from Ronn Lucas. Post back with your experience with the different angles. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
petegray 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2018 Norm's system works well with larger phlyz as well and is a pleasure to use... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bugsy 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2018 ^^^Yes, the fine point jaws aren't limited to small hooks. I believe that's what Ronn Lucas uses for his display flies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites