Another Debate? Bass Flys!

[down2earthlv 0]

Does it really make any sense to go all out and dress up bass bugs (especially terristrials)? Since the eyes and the ears are above the water, on TOP of the fly....Can the bass even see them? I say no way! I'll take the time to dress up a fly for a buddy, but all of mine are plain jane. I've fished both, sometimes side by side, and I haven't seen any prefrences. What do y'all think?

 

 

 

 

PS- TerryLee, if you're reading this, this googly eyed mouse will probably be finding a new home soon!

[Guest]

Yea, I agree. All the eyes and ears or whatever else you tie on a bass bug it is mostly fluff and only for the enjoyment of tying them that way. A case could be made for flies like a diver where the fly is pulled under the surface but even in that case I don't think that stuff is needed.

 

I mostly see bass coming almost straight up and hitting the fly from underneath so I don't think they could possibly see what is tied on top of the fly.

[down2earthlv 0]

I've been on the phone with my bassin 'pro' buddy since I posted the topic, and he says that the general color could make a difference, but for the most part bass are opportunistic and reactive predators. If he ever got into fly fishing or tying he said that his topwater bugs would probably not have eyes. However, in support of your theroy to subsurface, he also said that he refuses to fish spinner baits without eyes on them because there is definitely a huge difference in the strike ratio between the two. (As we speak, my sharpies are busily adding eyes to all my spinnerbaits!)

[mgj 0]

bass'll hit nearly anything, I've found. one time.

 

 

[Steeldrifter 0]

I am always of the school of thought that the siloute and color are the two main things that make a fly attractive to a fish more than any fine details.

[Kodiak Commando 0]

I don't think eyes would matter on a dry fly but eyes make a huge difference in subsurface minnow paterns in my experience. A red throat marking also makes a difference. Minnow patterns with eyes always outfish minnow patterns without eyes i have found. In fact it seems that minnow patterns with yellow and black eyes alway outfish ones with black and white eyes, go figure :dunno:

[mcfly 0]

I've seen flat balsa wood plugs shaped like mice before. Maybe someone should try that theory out and see if it works.

[FKROW 0]

Actually the fish can see the eyes and ears on surface flies. Check out the studies done on the "fishes window" or what a fish sees on the surface, you will be surprised at the optical qualities of water. Trout FF have known for years the fish sees the wings first, then the body as a fly drifts into the fish window.

 

Does it matter? Probably not however, the flies are somehow incomplete without large plastic eyes.

 

Regards,

Fred Krow

[jcstikfish 0]

Actually the fish can see the eyes and ears on surface flies. Check out the studies done on the "fishes window" or what a fish sees on the surface, you will be surprised at the optical qualities of water. Trout FF have known for years the fish sees the wings first, then the body as a fly drifts into the fish window.

 

Does it matter? Probably not however, the flies are somehow incomplete without large plastic eyes.

 

Regards,

Fred Krow

 

 

In addition to what Fred mentioned, what about enjoyment of fishing a particular fly. If you enjoy fishing a more detailed, realistic pattern, you will most likely fish it better and then it becomes a more effective fly.

 

Just my $.02

 

~James

[Gregg A 0]

I firmly beleive there are only two kinds of flys. The ones that catch fish and the ones that catch fishermen. A lot of the things we do to our flies are for the fishermen. We take pride in our work and want them to look nice. I think if the fish are hungry, they dont pay much attention to detail like we do. Below the surface I think they look at things a lot closer. A drunk Indian once told me that if you can see the fish, the fish can see you, so if they can see you, they can see whats on your your fly.

[TerryLee 0]

I firmly beleive there are only two kinds of flys. The ones that catch fish and the ones that catch fishermen. A lot of the things we do to our flies are for the fishermen. We take pride in our work and want them to look nice. I think if the fish are hungry, they dont pay much attention to detail like we do. Below the surface I think they look at things a lot closer. A drunk Indian once told me that if you can see the fish, the fish can see you, so if they can see you, they can see whats on your your fly.

 

Hey, I think that indian was my uncle, but I digress :hyst: .

 

Seems to me that silhouette, or shape, would be more important than anything else. Most of my experience in that regard is with bait casting/spinning tackle, but it still applies.

 

Two points:

 

1. The most effective baits for catching bass at night are usually black or another dark, solid color. Reason being, the hard silhouette against the limited light available. Hard to make out color at 3:00 AM.

 

2. If you aren't catching fish on a particular worm/crankbait/spinner bait, changing color of the bait and sticking with the same bait probably won't help. Most of the time, I have found, you must change to another lure shape completely.

 

But who really knows? Just keep trying lures until you run out of ideas/patience, then try some more until you just can't take it. But always have fun!

 

TL

 

YIPPEE!!!! A cool little mousie!!!!!

 

 

[Redwings1 0]

I agree that silhouette and color are important, but I think the action you impart to your fly does the most. It is evident to me when I take people out and get them on a pattern whether or not they are conident in that pattern, and that confidence in a pattern generally seems to show in the way a pattern is fished. When people have confidence in a pattern they seem to pay more attention to what they are doing and follow each cast through to completion , as opposed to half assing it and then wondering why they aren't catching fish. In short I think that confidence in any given pattern at any given time is nearly equal in importance to success as nearly any other factor. If it takes individual veins in a dragonfly dry fly pattern for you to be confident in it, then I'd say for you those details are necessary. As for me, I tie in some detail on my flies more to show off to other guys on the water than to catch more fish...

[Dble Haul 0]

Actually the fish can see the eyes and ears on surface flies. Check out the studies done on the "fishes window" or what a fish sees on the surface, you will be surprised at the optical qualities of water. Trout FF have known for years the fish sees the wings first, then the body as a fly drifts into the fish window.

 

Does it matter? Probably not however, the flies are somehow incomplete without large plastic eyes.

 

Regards,

Fred Krow

 

Fred is dead on here. The fish see more than we think they do because of the physical and optical qualities of the water, but in the long run it may not make much of a difference.

 

[Alex C. 0]

I once was trying to catch a bedded bass just a few feet off shore. I threw everything I had at it, still chucking lures at the time, and the best I could get it to do was come and remove my offering from it's little area without actualy taking it enough that Icould set the hool. THis was cool to me, I was about 15-16, and had never had the chance to study a fishes reaction to what I was doing before. Well, a few minutes into this I catch a dragonfly flying just off the water's surface right at us(me and the bass), as it was flying by it dropped down and touched the water about 3 feet to the right from where the bass was sitting. Well that bass was there on top of that exact spot at that exact moment faster than you know what. It missed the dragonfly, but I learned alot about how developed their senses are. Could that bass see that dragonfly coming, yes, in the slow motion replay in my head the bass started to go at the dragongly when it was about 2 feet from the spot it dropped down. How the bass anticipated this is awesome and I don't know. But the moral is fish see whats above the surface better than we think. A mouse will work without ears, eyes and whiskers but take some pride in the flys you tie and push yourself to tie the best flys possible. Just my .01 cent

[TerryLee 0]

Ok, so now we're back at square one, what makes the best bass flys the best?

 

So far, it seems like personal preference rules the day. Whatever they's bitin', you'd best be a-throwin' it, hear?