measuring soft hackle

[Fish For Life 0]

I was trying to tye some soft hackle flys today but the hackle i was using was to long. How do you measure soft hackle to fit a hook.

Thanks

[Bruce Derington 0]

How are you tying in the hackle, by the butts or the tips? I think general rule is to select a feather thzt is equal to or slightly shorter than the lengyh of the shank and only one turn. When I saw Slyvester Nemes tie he tied hackle in bythe tips and his length came to tip of the hook point.

[riffleriversteelheadslayer 0]

Bruce nailed it now if you can't find a feather small enough you can cut the fibers off of a larger feather and put them in a split thread to adjust the length

[netabrookie 0]

I came across a method of hackling a soft hackle a few years back called the distribution wrap. You can use fibers that are much too long from any feather you choose and still make a nice looking collar. To flare the fibers or hackle out you need to build up a thorax first and then choose you feather. After stripping enough fibers from the feather to create a collar that will go all the way around the hook, place them on top as you normally would to tie in. Tie the fibers in with a couple of loose wraps and then put tension on your thread and allow the fibers to spin around the hook much like you would when spinning deer hair. The fibers should spin completely around the hook and form a nice collar that looks almost the same as regular hackle. Now all of those feathers that are too big and kind of useless to tyers that do little flies are now not so useless. I have a soft hackle fly by Sylvester Nemes in a frame and Bruce is absolutely correct. The hackle on the fly that Mr. Nemes tied is just slightly past the point of the hook. I have been tying some this afternoon with the technique that Riff mentioned and thought it sort of funny that I took a break from tying and then read about the same style that I have been doing for the past few hours. Take Care, Tony

[flytire 0]

good info here

 

http://www.flytyingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=71698

[zOnk 0]

The correct answer to that question depends on the school of soft-hackle tying you belong to.

 

In the "ultra-sparse" school (Nemes, Hughes) the body of the fly does not extend to the barb/bend of the hook but ends at the point. They are tied on 1x length hooks and the hackle is usually the length of the hook shaft.

 

In the match-the-hatch school of soft hackles, where the body length of the fly is wrapped to match a natural (from barb/bend to eye) the hackle length should be as long as the body.

 

If tying a flymph, the hackle is slightly longer than the gape of the hook.

[tctrout 0]

The correct answer to that question depends on the school of soft-hackle tying you belong to.

 

In the "ultra-sparse" school (Nemes, Hughes) the body of the fly does not extend to the barb/bend of the hook but ends at the point. They are tied on 1x length hooks and the hackle is usually the length of the hook shaft.

 

In the match-the-hatch school of soft hackles, where the body length of the fly is wrapped to match a natural (from barb/bend to eye) the hackle length should be as long as the body.

 

If tying a flymph, the hackle is slightly longer than the gape of the hook.

This information is very consistent with a lot of the books I have seen, and an excellent resource is Mike Harding's "A Guide to North Country Flies." He ties the majority of his feathers to the hook barb/bend, and though I agree with his methods, I personally tend to extend the hackle on my own. This varies with the fly I'm tying, but I tend to concentrate more on the amount of feathers versus their length.

 

Here's a recent video of a fly I tied with Hungarian Partridge soft hackle; the length was extended nearly over the bend, which helps to represent the caddis is a number of stages:

 

 

Tim

[Roadkill 0]

I was trying to tye some soft hackle flys today but the hackle i was using was to long. How do you measure soft hackle to fit a hook.

Thanks

 

The correct answer if there is one, is that there are many styles of soft hackles and flymphs. Some antique North County Spiders show hackles that would trail well past the hook bend. The West Country School doesn't necessarily agree with the North Country in fly design and both catch fish.

 

I would suggest that the more important question is... How do you measure the bug you are trying to imitate rather than concentrating on a hook? You can use various hooks for weight variation while tying the same size fly. What is it about the natural that are you imitating legs, wings, shuck? The same style of SH or Flymph will vary a great deal when you compare mayflies, caddis and midges. The same insect will vary depending on the lifestage you can imitate. Are you fishing it as a nymph, larva, pupa, emerger, cripple, or adult-subsurface egg laying, spent, or drowned? Fishing soft hackles and flymphs is more about observing the naturals in your area and imitating them than imitating other tyers.

[Piker20 0]

A well made point by roadkill. If I want a fly to handle an expected larger stamp of fish I will use a larger hook but same hackle finishing at point where as smaller fish see a smaller hook with same hackle now past the bend but still achieving same profile size in the water.

[zOnk 0]

@Piker20 -- Hook sizes for soft hackles is yet another proverbial can of worms. The variances on hook choices for soft hackles make it so difficult to give a straight answer to new tiers trying to use hooks to calculate proportions (as you noted).

 

 

To try and simplify this subject for new tiers here are some basic soft hackle (not flymph) rules (which are meant to be broken):

 

1) Think of soft hackles as a 360 umbrella, where the hackle represents both wing and legs.

 

2) The hook bend sinks first as the fly drifts down stream -- looking a lot like a umbrella. The sinking pushes the hackles open and lets the current tease hackles and create movement.

 

3) This profile and position in the water prompted the tie from hook point forward thinking -- as no matter what the position of the fly the body size would never be "obstructed" by a hook point and appear unnatural in size.

 

 

What's most important in all the variations is how and where you intend to fish your soft hackles -- to control where the fly is in the water column.

 

Riffles, fast tail water, deep slow bends: heavy/strong hooks on a longer shaft tied to the point give more weight for sinking in fast water

 

Shallow (2-3ft) slick, slow water: heavy/strong hook, 1xl shank, tied to bend -- for medium sink

 

Always tie your patterns on light wire hooks as well -- for fishing in film when needed. If you believe matching size is absolute for instances where you fish the film during a hatch, tie to point on 2xl light wire hooks ( as noted soft hackle tier Dick Walle did).