tiny fly questions

[cphubert 0]

I do not fish smaller than 20's, but have tied them down to 28's for others that had to have them. Some have asked for tippet tied in others not.

[Stoneflylama72 0]

Like most others have said, I tie the very small (20-26) flies on oversized hooks with short shanks. My favorite hook for this is the Daiichi 1140 but lately have been using hooks that are styled after Tiempco 2488 and 206bl. Allows for a size 20-22 fly on a #18 hook and 24-26 flies on # 20 or #22 hook. Most of the time I can get by with the flies on #18 hooks and 6x Fluoro tippet. Occasionally though it's necessary to go to the #20 or #22 flies and 7X tippet, mostly when the trout are keyed in on surface feeding smooth water. I usually use a small yarn strike indicator about 3 feet above a floating midge emerger in this scenario. Any activity close to the indicator and I try to set the hook. A small dry fly can also be used in place of the indicator. I don't know why I prefer at least 3 feet between indicator (or indicator fly)and fly instead of a shorter length. I just have always done it and have confidence in it. I tried a short length but quickly changed back when I didn't get any takes. Not much experience so not much confidence.

[troutguy 0]

Small dry flies? Two words, Davidson River. In North Carolina there is a trout hatchery about Brevard on the Davidson. I routinely fish 26 and 28 sized dry flies. There are many trout over 20 inches cruising the clear water. These fish have seen every fly. You need a thin leader, a picture perfect drift, very small flies and God throwing you a solid to catch one. I have spent winged black and white tricos and and Catskill style BWO and Cahills in 28.

 

To be successful, a small fly needs to be honest in following hackle sized proportions. I've seen tiers say they have a #28, but the hackle is a size 18. If you have trouble seeing a small fly, tie the wing out of poly egg material (it is very fine) in chartreuse or bright pink.

[vicrider 0]

I have commented several times how much I really enjoy tying the little stuff but never fish unless a guide ties it on. Many guys say they can't tie or fish smaller than an 18 so for the recent fly swap I tied a bunch of bi-visibles with green hackle and white front. When I tied them laid a 6x tippet under the body and SA and tied it in. On that I tied a dropper of a 24 short shank hooks with 1.5 mm tungsten bead and green body thread and silver wire rib. Now the guys who can never fish smaller than an 18 can fish a 24 easily until they break off.

 

I have several 30s and 32s tied with proportioned hackle. When I finish them I tie the head with a couple of whips and a touch of SA, then make sure is open and run and twist a wire through. This helps to keep from losing them and anyone who asks for one gets one or two and can't say the eye was plugged that way.

[Patriot 0]

My preferred trout water is the San Juan river in Northern New Mexico. From past experience most mayflies are typically a size #20 or #22. Midges, which is the predominate fish food, range from #24 to smaller. I have no desire to tie anything smaller than #24 flies.

 

There is also reportedly, a 'hatch' of black carpenter ants that bring the river to life. I have never experienced this, but I've been told that ugly black stimulator or peacock caddis flies in size #10 will do the trick. But, by and large, the San Juan is a river of very small flies that must use to be successful.

[Sandan 0]

Small flies, San Juan river, South Platte River too. We commonly fish 22,24 and 26's. If I could find smaller hooks I'd tie on them also. For dries I use TMC 100's. I think even though they're small they are better proportioned for dires than the 2487/88 which I use for nymphs and emergers. 7x is usually plenty small enough for tippet, but 6x will usually work. 7 when the water is really flat/low/slow. A hi-viz parachute in those sizes can be seen sort of easily. Sometimes we'll tie a 20 in front as an indicator. Like a 20 PMD on 6x down to a 24/26 trico spinner on 7. About 12-18" between them.

[bellevue.chartreuse.trout 0]

...

[Fletchfishes 0]

I keep some 28 and 30 midges - mostly emerged style with a CDC wing - on a threader in a small box. On the tailwater I fish here in MA there days when that's all that will work on the surface. 7x tippet.

 

I have some Tiemco dry hooks in 28 but normally use the Gama emerger hooks. They have a nice gape and are remarkably strong for the size.

[ihang10 0]

So, the theory I'd apply to small flies like tricos is to tie a cluster of tricos on a larger hook, in a similar manner to the theory behind a Griffith's gnat: it's a cluster of bugs vs one bug.

 

That being said, dry flies aren't my favorite presentation.

 

I dunno, I just fished the North Platte in Wyoming this week, the trico hatch was incredibly frustrating for me. Guide used the smallest fly he had behind a size 16 Adams. In any case I can't say we were overly successful. I know people who fished 18& 16 purple hazes and 16-14 prince nymphs during this epic hatch with better success.

[vicrider 0]

These flies are a series from 32-20 including a size 20 Royal Coachman on 1x long 20. The wire is .017 showing a tippet will really go through the eyes. Sometimes I really get in the mood to tie these and also small beadhead nymphs in 24 especially. Parachutes in 22 and 24 also are fun to tie. Do I fish them? Nah, only if guide ties one on. I have tied some recently with a bi-visible and 6x tippet going to a 24 beadhead all ready to go. Just tie on the 14 and the 24 is already there ready to follow behind 1' or 2' down. I've offered before that if someone is interested in really trying a couple of these let me know and I'll send a few ONLY if you plan to fish them and hopefull show us a pic or two with fish really landed on them.

This is a 32 with tail, dubbing, hackle

This is a size 26 with grizzly tip wings, the smallest I've tied wings to date...Double checked...It's a 28 mosquito pattern

[flytire 0]

tie double tricos on a size 16 hook

 

[vicrider 0]

I'll see your double trico and raise ya' a double Chronomid on a 16, then an 18 hook

[Sandan 0]

To Vicrider,

 

Ever use a turkey flat fora post on those itty-bittys. I've been trying but the flat fibers slip out of my fingers. I don't want to get/make a gallows tools so I was wondering as you seem to have experience. Usually I'll use McFlylon or poly for a post or split wing and then cut 'em down to size when I'm done.

[vicrider 0]

Sandan, sorry for late comeback. All I ever use is a length of white poly yarn. On the average yarn I segment 3 pieces out of it. I take one of those pieces I cut about 2" long or so and loop it around thread and lift to top of hook. I make a couple of wrap in middle of split poly, then go side to side and loop around base to hold in place. Then I hold poly in fingers and lift hard, wrapping thread around 3/4 of base hard until I have to let go and move past my fingers. I go light there and grab poly again and wrap hard. I do this to the height I want my post and then wrap back down. At that point I usually wrap thread to back of hook and dab my post with a shot of CA. Tie in the tail, either wrap a thread body with a dubbed thorax or all dubbed body.

 

This is where learning how little dubbing you need comes into play. A wisp of dubbing rolled tight so you've basically made a slightly fatter thread is all you need. You can see in the macro shots that a little bit is plenty on those size hooks. At this point I do something a little different than most. I loop the tying thread over the post, grab the fly and turn it in the vise down to about an angle of 4:30 or 5:00 on a clock face. I hold the feather so the stem ends where the post ends. I wrap up the post and back down, move my bobbin to the left of the fly and hang it on a screw head (Renzetti vise). I wrap the feather down hoping I've got the curve of the feathers facing up. After whatever wraps work for me, give or take 5 wraps, I hold the end of the feather down, grab the bobbin and wrap around the base of the post locking feather in with a couple of turns, the do a two turn whip finish under feathers right on post. When I slide thread on hook on the whip finisher up a quarter inch or so from post I put a dab of CA right on the thread, then pull tight, snip and trim.

 

I know this sounds confusing and I'm really bad on giving directions on anything but if you follow along this works for me down to as small as 26 fine. Getting smaller than that I usually go with just the tail, thread or dubbing, and hackle collar. To get hackle that fits the sizes needed I've spent the money to buy 100 fly packs or Whiting hackle. The half dozen or so really will tie a large amount of flies, though I haven't actually counted to a hundred. I do know that the long, fine feathers you get in those is a pleasure to work with instead of pulling those little short feathers in that size range from the very top of a cape.

[McFlyLures 0]

Small flies, San Juan river, South Platte River too. We commonly fish 22,24 and 26's. If I could find smaller hooks I'd tie on them also. For dries I use TMC 100's. I think even though they're small they are better proportioned for dires than the 2487/88 which I use for nymphs and emergers. 7x is usually plenty small enough for tippet, but 6x will usually work. 7 when the water is really flat/low/slow. A hi-viz parachute in those sizes can be seen sort of easily. Sometimes we'll tie a 20 in front as an indicator. Like a 20 PMD on 6x down to a 24/26 trico spinner on 7. About 12-18" between them.

Gamakatsu makes a size 30 hook... high quality also! Just expensive