Dragon Nymph ?

[Joe Hard 0]

I caught and kept a brown trout yesterday. It was full of worms, and had a few of these in its belly.

 

 

I am guessing they are dragon fly nymphs, they are about an inch and a half long. Its hard to tell because the were inside the fish. I really dont know what they are, anyone have any ideas?

 

Here, starting June third we have an Apple Blossom Festival. Usually every year I will Try to catch a fair size brown trout to stuff it and barbecue. This year I caught a 23 inch 5lb. brown. I had nowhere to put it, so I kept on a stringer and attached it to my wading belt. On the way home I put it in the sleeve of my rain jacket and wrapped it up. The contents of the fishes belly came out. You want to talk about stink. I bet there was a cup full. :sick:

 

 

[Taxon 0]

Daryn-

 

A bit hard to tell, but I believe it looks more to me like a caddisfly, probably Rhyacophilidae. Perhaps the next time Ethan Bright visits the forum, he will comment. I wouldn't be surprised if he could even tell you what species it is.

[Joe Hard 0]

Thanks. When I first discovered it I though caddis as well, but when I got a closer look. I poked through the mess with a twig and saw how big it was. I said wow whats that? When I saw the pictures uffepuffe posted with the first dragon. I took a wild stab at it.

 

Like I said this bug is 1 & 1/2 inches long

[mlongmire 0]

I have seen these giants here in East Tennessee too. I don't think that it is a green rock worm (caddis). It is way too big. My best guess is that is is the larvae of a dobsonfly. Though I can't pick out the the feathery appendages that would be present on the abdomen of a dobsonfly larvae (Hellgramite). I do know that these larvae can be up to 3 inches long.

 

My other guess is that it is one of the few cranefly larvae that live below the waterline.

[Joe Hard 0]

There were hairs along the rear part of the abdomen. You can see a couple that are still there in the first pic. I did notice a few crane flies flying around. What ever it is, its a big juicy light and dark olive nymph, with a black head. About a size 4 TMC 200 R hook. I just measured it again, layed flat from its broken tail to its head its 2 inches long.

[Redwings1 0]

My first impression this morning after reading the size was cranefly as well, butthe head is not right...

[Taxon 0]

I have seen these giants here in East Tennessee too. I don't think that it is a green rock worm (caddis). It is way too big. My best guess is that is is the larvae of a dobsonfly. Though I can't pick out the the feathery appendages that would be present on the abdomen of a dobsonfly larvae (Hellgramite). I do know that these larvae can be up to 3 inches long.

 

My other guess is that it is one of the few cranefly larvae that live below the waterline.

mlongmire-

 

I think you've zeroed us in on the right order (Megaloptera) and family (Corydalidae), and that as you say, it's probably the larva of either a dobsonfly (subfamily Corydalinae), or perhaps of a fishfly (subfamily Chauliodinae), which are both referred to as Hellgrammites, Toe Biters, etc.

[Ethan Bright 0]

Hi:

 

I think it's a larva of Chauloides (Megaloptera: Corydalidae), but I cannot make out the species based on the photos. I probably can if I have the specimen in hand. Yes, it's a dobsonfly, but it's not a hellgrammite (Corydalus spp.). Corydalus larvae have filamentous gills on the ventral portion of the abdominal segments; larvae of Chauloides and Nigronia do not. To the left there appears to be an elongate respiratory tube (there should be two, but they're markedly uneven in length), which differentiates it from Nigronia. Based on the fish (warmwater bass), it almost certainly Chauloides, as Nigronia tend to be found in cool to cold lotic environments. Indeed, Nigronia has very short respiratory tubes, which isn't a problem in oxygen saturated, cooler running waters, whereas Chauloides are long, which it probably needs in warmer, oxygen-poorer lentic waters.

 

Here's the way to distinguish the species of Chauloides larvae:

 

1. a. Middorsal stripe of abdomen black; b. Length of the longer respiratory tube as long as combined middorsal lengths of Ab6-8 or Ab5-8 - Chauliodes rastricornis Rambur

1'. a. Middorsal stripe of abdomen yellowish b. Length of the longer respiratory tube as long as combined middorsal lengths of Ab7-8 - Chauliodes pectinicornis (Linneaus).

 

One of these days I'll get some detail photos of these for my web site, Aquatic Insects of Michigan (http://insects.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/~ethanbr/aim/index.html).

 

What ecologists do is take the larva, dissect it, and examine the contents of its gut in order to get an idea of the food web. In southeastern Michigan, I often find Chauloides rasticornis in fens and other wetlands, and they begin to move to woody debris and land to pupate towards the end of April. The adults are very impressive beasts.

 

Cheers, Ethan

[Joe Hard 0]

Thanks guys for all your help. You guys sure know your stuff.