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Freddo

Rod Length: 9'-0" or 8'-6"

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Hey Adam --

I watched a guy on YouTube catching enormous GT's (never seen them before) on 12WT and 100 lb. leader in clear ocean water. THAT looked like fun. Finessing the small fish with a 6'-6" light weight may be fun too one day so I suppose it's game on (and hopefully "fish on"). Let's see how things go after starting which will be soon enough!

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Yep Freddo! It's all fun! Saltwater fly fishing is something i'd love to do! Wait till you catch your first trout on your own made dryfly, then you will be glowing for ages!:-)

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Yep Freddo! It's all fun! Saltwater fly fishing is something i'd love to do! Wait till you catch your first trout on your own made dryfly, then you will be glowing for ages!:-)

Amen to that !!

 

Around here we have some ponds with Pumpkin Seeds ( Bluegill on steroids) and a great Crappy pond. 4wt. is the rule, 3 might be even better. And not a real spiny rod at that. It's awesome ! Salmon on a 5 wt or big browns on a 5 even more awesome. I'll take that over 21-22 " schoolie salt water bass any day, because the sea version hit, runs and then you drag in a sack of potatoes on your 8 wt.. Sea run trout are great though.

 

But you guys are talking about crazy big fish. I live on Cape Cod and go in my boat for bass but mostly spin fish, we jig for Sea Bass in the spring. My fly fishing is in estuaries as far as salt goes..

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Hey Dave -

 

Please don't get me wrong...I'd be more than happy to catch anything all day long. We all like the "bigger" fish but I find catching 10"-12" trout a great day. WE live in a lake community that's full of bluegill and pumpkin seed and I've been tying all kinds of flies to go for them. I'm going to start tying some flies with trout only in mind knowing full well there are crossover patterns. I've gleaned the Internet adn catalog pages for those "top 10" trout flies of all time (and we know that's always something begging its own thread here).

 

The snow is still here and I haven;t been past the lake to check the thaw but soon... I just need to learn to cast the rod I hope to buy this weekend.

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I hear ya Freddo. That was my point, rather catch small and mid sized trout or Salmon on a lighter rod than bigger guys on some rod that feels like a baseball bat. And Bluegill and Pumpkin Seeds can be a blast. Around here they turn on in May. Trout you can fish right from ice out.

 

Don't know what you have for insects there but I'd start tying some wet patterns for the early fishing. Generics would be Gold Ribbed Hairs Ear Nymph size 12-16. I tie those slightly weighted and I like to make the wing case out of Peacock Herl, deadly everywhere.I've fished. It will cross to Bluegill too. Soft Hackles. All color bodies, bright for Blue Gill, more subdued for browns. A popular one is a wire ribbed Peacock Herl Body with Soft Hen or Partridge collar. Very simple to tie, very effective to fish. Catch anything in the lake or stream on it. Tied 8-16. Can be tied on Nymph hooks for a variation or just wet hooks. Another variation of this is Bright colored floss body. A great cross fly is small Woolie Buggers. I tie one on a 12 hook red yarn body with Grizzly Hackle, small red tag off the back. Rainbows or Bluegill will like it. Tie them in olive, tie them with peacock Herl body, olive tail or black tail and Grizzly Hackle. Another fly that will catch anything, tie them all sizes actually.

 

I won't turn you on to Muddlers yet, you are a beginning tier. but those flies above should get you started on a mixed species wet system and be productive.

 

When you can cast then midges will be up for grabs, another whole kind of fly fishing. Intense fishing and in still water when trout are on midges and you don't fish midges then you can sit back and watch the ones who do catch fish !! And bait fishermen might just as well go home. I've seen it happen locally. I fished near a couple of guys, couldn't catch a thing, the fish were right there in front of them rising away. One Guy started yelling curses, ready to throw his rod in the water, I just smiled.. The other just watched ( the smarter of the two).. I showed them what I was using, they said "that's it" ? ! MIdge Emergers/pupa/Buzzers ( basically some thread on an#18 or #20 hook with a little tiny piece of antron sticking out the ends) and 4-6 ft of 6X tippet making up about a 12 ft leader in all.. That and #20 Griffiths Gnats. Beautiful fish too, cruisers just sipping away on midges right up top.

 

Soft hackles are on my mind because I'm tying them right now LOL!

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Thanks Dave - I'll go with your recommendations as I've practicing only wet flies at the moment. I've got a little tied of everything (because I'm trying all types of flies but no dry ones yet). I need to get some more nymph hooks in different sizes too. I've tied some wooly type buggers in red with ball chain eyes, red chenille body, and red webby feather fibers from the soft hackle I tied up front. The look nice and inagine the bluegills will love them but until I'm pulling them around the fish I won't know.

 

So in the lake for these bluegill types, how do you retrieve them, a 6" strip / pause / strip / pause?

 

So much to learn and I appreciate the input!

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Thanks Dave - I'll go with your recommendations as I've practicing only wet flies at the moment. I've got a little tied of everything (because I'm trying all types of flies but no dry ones yet). I need to get some more nymph hooks in different sizes too. I've tied some wooly type buggers in red with ball chain eyes, red chenille body, and red webby feather fibers from the soft hackle I tied up front. The look nice and inagine the bluegills will love them but until I'm pulling them around the fish I won't know.

 

So in the lake for these bluegill types, how do you retrieve them, a 6" strip / pause / strip / pause?

 

So much to learn and I appreciate the input!

If you like the buggers don't be afraid to experiment with colors. Variations, some yellow bodies, try some Chartreuse yarn or chenille. Large mouth Bass absolutely love large woolie buggers incidentally. Early season bass here take my Peacock herl bodied ones with black tail and Grizzly hackle, black thread, tied #6 streamer hooks and weighted.. Very slow retrieve in the early May cool waters in the shallows.

 

Blue gill retrieve for wet flies is a slow steady movement with short spurts pause, then repeat. They will hit about anything, especially in Spawn season, so don't get to scientific about fly patterns. They do like some color and or bugginess. I've had them take the Professor wet fly though and also Brook trout in still water have taken that fly. It's a fun fly to tie and expands your capability closer to tying dry flies. And it's a classic looking fly you can take some pride in. Not the most productive on multi species but panfish like them and you can feel like a trout fly tier in the process !! I have only had Brookies take them in the trout species, LOL.. If you have an old Orvis tying book it's listed there or look for videos. At least check it out, it's a very old pattern.

 

Bluegill take dry flies !! So much fun on a really light rod ( I use my 7' 3-4 wt but a 5 is fine ). Griffiths Gnats, Adams, Small Royal Coachman or Royal Wulfe dries ( I absolutely love tying Royal Wulfes and Green Royal Wulfes too, check out Davie McPhails video on tying the Green Royal Coachman). Tie them around size 14-16. They will try to hit larger dries but their small mouths will not succeed, generally speaking. The Griffiths Gnat is a very easy fly to tie, not much different from a woolie bugger in skill, actually easier. You just need decent Grizzly hackle, maybe buy a Half Cock Neck that has the lower section with some really small hackles there. Because later on tying these in size 18 can land you some beautiful trout in a midge hatch.. you can use the same hackles as part of the Adams tie as well. Very useful to own.

 

Don't forget that Hairs Ear in all sizes, it imitates a bunch of stuff from emerging mayflies to small ( baby) bait fish. I tie them in olive, big for the drake hatches, like size 6 or 8. I tie them small in black and also in the natural tan or light browns. I tie them from size 20 all the way up to 6. And then cream/buff and olive colored for Hex hatches..

 

Poppers ? Amazing, a Chartruese rubber legged pan fish popper can grab you the biggest Smallie in the lake on occasion.! White perch mess with it, Large Mouth will take it too. Wait till June or July to try it out. Put your dream state in motion and you can think you are in a Northern river and a huge brook trout just jumped your dry fly. I've had big trout and Salmon take a big Red Royal Wulfe in the rivers up north right in the middle of a smoking Caddis hatch. Sail that thing down the river where you saw a big fish rise in the hatch and wham, head and tails right on the Wulfe. I tie those in Size 8 and 10, in a size 18 or 16 caddis hatch they stand out like the Queen Mary. No missing where it is on the river !

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Freddo, as to casting for Blue Gill. If you can just learn to carry a line in the air and let it drop on the water you will catch fish. Don't be concerned initially with big long casts that take double hauls to get a fly out to where you want it. Not up front anyway, worry about that later on. Especially in the spring, Blue Gills will be right in the shallows, You can wade out a bit and cast parallel to the shore line to catch them. Early trout will often be in the same place, earlier than the blue gill though, like right after ice out.. This is still water I'm talking about.

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Ha Dave.... You are so kind to share so much (other than the apparent enthusiasm)!

 

I appreciate all of your input and will glean from your text and make a list of patterns and sizes to try. I'll pick up a fly box over the weekend and start tying a collection. I haven't read up much on if hook size matters (or at least incremental variations (i.e., 10, 12, 14, 16, etc. vs. 10, 14, 18, etc.). Are "fish" really that picky? I know a smaller bluegill cannot take a larger fly but that's common sense. However a 2 lb. trout...will it think to itself, hey that's to big, or that's way too small, or just: "Hey I'm hungry and I'm eating that fly/nymph/wet/dry/whatever size?"

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Ha Dave.... You are so kind to share so much (other than the apparent enthusiasm)!

 

I appreciate all of your input and will glean from your text and make a list of patterns and sizes to try. I'll pick up a fly box over the weekend and start tying a collection. I haven't read up much on if hook size matters (or at least incremental variations (i.e., 10, 12, 14, 16, etc. vs. 10, 14, 18, etc.). Are "fish" really that picky? I know a smaller bluegill cannot take a larger fly but that's common sense. However a 2 lb. trout...will it think to itself, hey that's to big, or that's way too small, or just: "Hey I'm hungry and I'm eating that fly/nymph/wet/dry/whatever size?"

Pan fish aren't fussy. Trout may not be fussy at times but when a hatch is on you bet they are !! Browns in particular.

 

But overall, you will get fish, they just can get fussy , yes.. General form is what they see and color can trigger them to take the fly. It's conceivable to tie a shortened pattern in a 16 and fool the fish that are keyed to 18's. But if they are on 18's, they probably aren't taking a 12. If they are on emergers they might take a little bigger fly because the natural flies don't just get up and running clean, they may trail shucks before they get off the water.. And then sometimes they fool you, small muddlers may rule in some other kind of hatch. Nothing is etched in stone, it's about reducing misses. You will learn soon enough !

 

Additionally, you have tied Clouser style woolie buggers, i suspect those will be effective. In ponds around here small buck tail streamers can be good. I must admit I am slowly taking to craft furs and synthetic fibers like you get in packs of Syn-Yak for variation in colors though. One traditional streamer I tie for here as buck tail and keep it pure buck tail is the Black Nosed Dace. One large pond here gets herring in it. The spring run will start any time, though this year is cold, so maybe not just yet ! But as the season goes on the baby herring gang up in clouds in the water to go out the river way to the ocean. And then bait fish patterns become more important. It's good to learn and keep tabs on season changes in your own local waters.

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I'm convinced that when the rubber meets the road (but in reality, when the fly meets the water), I'll learn what works and doesn't. Your last post makes me now think I need to learn how to study the natural insect life on the rivers and lakes near me even though generic patters will work. It's a;; part of the bigger picture.

 

Now - since thread started as a fly rod length question. I'll start a new topic for asking about fly boxes. :)

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Freddo! There is a way you can have the best of both worlds! But it would cost a fortune, Hardy zenith sintrix 5wt one piece 8' 10"! Also when you start fishing, i imagine you will chew up some leaders, save them & tie on a piece of wool & go out casting on the lawn so you can get a feel of lhe line working! When you need waders, buy them in winter, u'll get a better deal! I used rubber boots for years just so i could walk through shalow waters to get to islands & better banks to cast from! Make some cdc&elk dry flies, they work great & from tying that flie you will learn a cdc tecneack that will help with later flies & also get practice in tying on elk or deer hear = it wants to slip around the shank in first turns! I buy el cheapo fly boxes, my van doors, glove box, bum bag, jacket pockets, float tube pockets, cupboards, mini bra outside shed have fly boxes in them!:-)

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I'm convinced that when the rubber meets the road (but in reality, when the fly meets the water), I'll learn what works and doesn't. Your last post makes me now think I need to learn how to study the natural insect life on the rivers and lakes near me even though generic patters will work. It's a;; part of the bigger picture.

 

Now - since thread started as a fly rod length question. I'll start a new topic for asking about fly boxes. smile.png

I have so many fly boxes I can hardly get my vest on, LOL !! I don't think I ever paid more than about $4 for any of them. But then it's been years since i bought any new ones, I don't even know todays cost. Some have the wavy foam inside to stick the flies into, some just compartments, they all hold flies. I even have prescription bottles full of flies.

 

And we won't discuss the tying case, it's so stuffed I bring along stuff in plastic bags sometimes.

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Hey Dave...

 

Convert a panel truck (or the like) into a mobile fly tying station and sales truck. Yeah - like the old ice cream trucks! Cruise along the rivers and around lakes and tie custom flies for guys that can't while they're out there. There now...no more plastic bags and an income to boot! BTW - I did start a new thread questioning the varieties of fly storage boxes just before reading this last post of yours. I'm sure to learn a few things!

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Hey Dave...

 

Convert a panel truck (or the like) into a mobile fly tying station and sales truck. Yeah - like the old ice cream trucks! Cruise along the rivers and around lakes and tie custom flies for guys that can't while they're out there. There now...no more plastic bags and an income to boot! BTW - I did start a new thread questioning the varieties of fly storage boxes just before reading this last post of yours. I'm sure to learn a few things!

i saw that.

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