Beginner Saltwater Materials List Help

[tsimon555 0]

Hello,

 

I have read many posts and info on putting together a basic set of materials for tying trout/freshwater flies (thread 6/0, hooks 12, 14, elk hair, deer hair, pheasant tail, beads size, etc.) and have done so but....

 

Can anyone help with suggestions for a Basic Beginners Saltwater Materials setup/kit?

 

I am on the west coast of FL and will be tying for gulf coast species; mostly snook, reds, specs, maybe some tarpon. Any suggestions, on maybe your top 15-20 materials and any special tools, besides the trout/freshwater basics?? Or a link if this has already been covered before...

 

Thanks in advance!!

Tony

[captkenroy 0]

Where on the West Coast? Lots of good clubs here. I live in Crystal River and most of my fishing is fly fishing,

 

List of materials? Since you are just starting, I'd recomment Mustad 3407 hooks for starters. Sizes 4 through 2/0 should cover most situations.

 

Bucktail--white, chartreuse, red, black, brown

 

Neck hackles in the same colors plus grizzly in a few colors.

 

Ice Chenille in brown, pearl, black and chartreuse (Estaz from craft stores works too)

 

Pearl Flashabou

 

White flat unwaxed monocord thread.

 

Lots of this stuff can be purchased at craft stores like Hobby Lobby and Jo-Ann's Fabrics--some Wal-Marts too.

 

With this stuff you can tie most flies you'll start out with.

 

Boogers, Deceivers and Clousers will cover most situations. Maybe a few poppers too.

[utyer 0]

Craft fur, Polar flash, Congo hair (similar to EP fibers,) or similar synthetics. I use various yarns in cream, white, tan, and other colors. The yarn brushes out into a fine hair. Mono thread, Veevus 6/0 thread. Mason hard mono (20# and 25 or 30 for larger flies,) for weed guards.

 

Poly macrame yarn brushes out into a courser hair than yarn, and is very good for minnow and bait fish patterns.

 

Ice wing, crystal flash, flashabou and other flash materials. I use pearl Christmas tree tinsel.

 

Bead chain, and various lead (dumb bell,) eyes.

 

For the most part, you will be tying imitations of shrimp, bait fish, and small crabs.

 

A very popular pattern (easy to tie,) is the Schminnow. For this you will need white marabou, and pear crystal chenille, or estaz in the large size. Other colors if the same pattern may work as well.

 

You would also want to get some epoxie or UV glue. UV glue will be set with a UV light so you will need that as well.

[Saltybum 0]

Agree with all the above. However you did not mention hooks. A very important part of a saltwater fly.

Mustad C68 series are strong and won't break the bank. The C47s are lighter for slower sinking flies and still good strength. And of course the 3407 0r 34007

Gamakatsu SC15, SL45, Owner 5106-031 just to name a few.

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Funny you ask!

A friend asked me to create/stock his new tying station at his camp down in South Louisiana. He asked to acquire everything needed to tie redfish and other saltwater flies for down there. He already had a vise.

He wanted to be totally setup and said the cost didn't matter, what you see below cost approx. $700. I think the only thing left out was some craft fur in the synthetic material box.

Just thought I'd share for anyone wanting to start in saltwater, you may get some ideas from my labels on the containers I put together for him.

Kirk

Wooden tool stands I made with brass rod fly holders across the tops. Hanging on the sides of the uprights are flush cutters, mini diagonal cutters, UV laser, smooth jaw pliers, magnetic pick-up pen and E-Z Lap diamond file for sharpening hooks. In holders are thick and thin formula superglue, Diamond Hard UV Resin, Sally Hansen's Hard as Nails, bodkins and Anvil scissors.

Hooks are Gamakatsu SC15 & SL12 and Mustad 34007, variety of lead barbell eyes, flat lead from Cascade and variety sizes of SS bead chain.

Threads are 3/0 and 210 Denier (Fly Master +), popper bodies are pre-shaped soft foam from Cascade, eyes are flat stick-on and 3d stick-on.

Body wrap materials include cactus chenille and crystal antron chenille.

[agn54 0]

You have some great advice so far. I agree with the hook selection above but would add Gamakatsu B10s stingers. I have come to love them for the a lot of my flies on the flats. One material I would definitely add to the list is finn raccoon and/or arctic fox. They are both very similar soft furs but finn raccoon is longer. Use as tails and wings in place of marabou or buck tail. It doesn't quite have the action of marabou (does anything?) but it is a lot tougher and does have fantastic action. You'll also want to get some super hair to use in place of buck tail for when the mackerel and blues show up.

 

When I first started tying I got something very similar to this saltwater kit (link) and used every part of it. Many around here will say to avoid a kit but for me it worked well to get going.

[Piker20 0]

Kirk, "set me up for tying, money not an issue" that's what you want to hear. Did you not just tell him your flies are available for only $10 a time. No need to worry himself with tying lol.

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

I've been tying for this guy for over ten years now and he usually tips me on the orders I send him, plus he lets me use his boat anytime I want when he isn't down using it - just wish I had time to take the two hour drive further down south to take him up on it more often. He did take me on a guided trip for my efforts with putting his station together. He did that mostly for his guests that he invites down to his camp so they will have something to do on bad weather days or at night, so, I'll still be tying flies for him.

I'm fortunate to have met this fella when I was guiding back in the 90's. To say he's a nice guy would be an understatement.

 

Kirk

[tsimon555 0]

Thanks for all the great info guys! Feel Free to Keep it coming. Will definitely be helpful!!

 

Wish I had the cash to employ Kirk to hook me up with a saltwater kit! I already have a nice vice and set of tools!!

 

Couple of questions:

 

-Most of ya'll use 3/0 thread for salt tying?

 

-How about wire size or does that just depend on depth needs of fly?

 

-Will Clear Goo UV Hydo serve my purpose for head cement for salt fly's or do I need actual head cement or something thicker, would like to stick with Clear Goo due to the UV watt BS, be it true or not.

 

-The difference in 3407 and 3407DT? Duratin coated, longer shank?? Any good for tying on a cheaper hook? (I know the 34007 is Stainless and better just saw 3407DT at WalMart for cheap)

 

-And what exactly is everyone getting at Dollar stores?? And Kraft stores besides peacock feather and chenille?

 

CaptKenRoy, I am in the bay area (mostly fish the Clearwater, Dunedin, and St. Pete areas. I know up in Crystal River/Homosassa there is supposed to be some good flats fishing!

 

Again, thanks for all the help guys and again please keep it coming if anything pops up. Maybe we can get a nice comprehensive saltwater list put together for the salt guys!

 

Tony

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Tony,

It was a job believe it or not.

Anyway, some of your questions.

I use 3/0 on smaller saltwater flies but mostly the Fly Master +, which is equiv to 210 denier. I like the way you can untwist it and have it lay flat so it actually works for all of my tying down to #4.

 

The Mustad company used to make a Stainless Steel hook and then went to what they called Z-Steel in their "Signature Series". From what I heard, a chemical they were using to formulate the Z-Steel was not good on the emissions end or something and the plant was told to cease using it. Now, they have gone to a finish similar to Gamakatsu, which I think as you noted is a Duratin finish. Not sure if they still make the original soft Stainless Steel hook or will resume making it.

 

If you have CCG already, go ahead and use it, however, if you don't, I wouldn't spend the money on it. If you have a light you need to use, I'd use either Deer Creek or Crystal UV, two truly tack free UV resins. Henry Kanemoto (aka SilverCreek, member on this forum) sells the Crystal UV. You can easily get and use Sally Hansens Hard as Nails with Nylon, been used for years and will prevent your thread from unraveling.

 

Craft stores offer sheet foam in different thicknesses that are good for Gurglers and other foam topped saltwater flies. Also, you can get mono thread from the sewing section and load it on an empty spool of thread to use on your bobbin and tie translucent flies. You can also get Liquid Fusion, which is a urethane glue that can be used for a thick protective coating having several applications where you would use UV resin or Epoxy. Doll eyes can be acquired from craft stores as well. Also, Craft Fur for small streamers. That's to name a few that come to mind, you have to just look around.

 

For wire, if you're talking about lead wire, I like the .015 for an all around weighting wire.

 

Kirk

[agn54 0]

Personally I prefer the 3407 DT to 34007 because they will rust out of the fish's mouth faster if they break off, and they are cheaper. For thread, I use many different ones, but my universal go-to thread is Danville flat waxed nylon. I also use a lot of fine mono

[tsimon555 0]

Personally I prefer the 3407 DT to 34007 because they will rust out of the fish's mouth faster if they break off, and they are cheaper. For thread, I use many different ones, but my universal go-to thread is Danville flat waxed nylon. I also use a lot of fine mono

Thanks might have to give those a try then!

 

agn54: What size Danville you do prefer for saltwater flies?

 

Thanks!!

 

Kirk- Thanks for the info, super helpful!!

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

agn, if you order what used to be the 34007, which was replaced by the Z-steel, not sure of the model number. You will get a shiny finished hook, not sure if it is Duratin or not. I didn't realize the old 3407 was a Duratin finish.

There are likely still some of the Z-steel hooks around and likely some of the old soft 34007s as well.

I thought steel had to be exposed to water and air alternately in order to rust. At least at any rate of speed? The exposure to air they get in your fly box after they are wet is a main reason they rust so quickly if not washed and rinsed off, at least I think so, I'm not corrosion expert..

If a fish stays underwater, how long will it take for the hook to rust out, I'd be willing to bet a barbless SS hook would fall out long before a barbed steel hook would rust out. Not sure, just my guess, never heard of anyone actually testing that out, all I've ever heard was speculation.

 

Kirk

[agn54 0]

Good points Kirk, I may have been fed a line of BS on the rate of rusting out. I usually bend down the barbs so hopefully they fall out soon enough. In any case, I like the 3407 DT just fine. I really like the C70s D which is a newer model of duratin hook by Mustad. They are 2x heavy and sharp out of the box.

 

tsimon555, it's just called Danville Flat Waxed Nylon, its 210 denier. Here is a link to it. It's on sale now at JStockards for pretty cheap

[Kirk Dietrich 0]

Oh yeah, I like that C70s a lot, very strong hook! The 3407 always was a stronger hook than the 34007. I always used the 34007 to make sure the fly didn't outlast the hook and it worked fine for redfish under 10lbs. Once you start catching them bigger than that unless you go to the really large sizes, those old soft 34007 hooks would open up on you. Realizing I and most guys down here use 20 lb tippet.

Oh, not saying a hook wouldn't rust out, and maybe pretty quickly, just never have seen any concrete data on it.

 

Kirk