What defines a fly as one for slow or fast water?

[thirstea 0]

Hi all,

 

What defines whether a fly is to be used in slow, fast waters or whether in ripples?

 

 

Thx

Thirstea

[phg 0]

What kind of fly?

 

A dry fly for fast water will be bushier so it floats better. For slow or still water, dry flies are generally more realistic, or, at least, more sparsely dressed.

 

A wet fly or streamer for fast water will have more weight on it, to get it down. One or slow water will have less weight, and feature materials with a lot of movement.

 

These, of course, are generalizations, and like all generalizations, totally unreliable.... You fish whatever fly works for as long as it works.

[djtrout 0]

Think about it from the fish's perspective: fish see and readily hit size 20 nymphs in roiling water. Their view of the water column is not ours. That said, of course if YOU want to track the fly, use a bushy one to float in fast water; however, even though the current may "drown" a more sparsely dressed fly, that doesn't mean it won't be effective. Just keep a sharp eye out on your line and keep tight lines. In fast water, make sure you deliberately swing your fly at the end of the run, er, float, as it were.

The difference is size and visibility of flies is something we tiers and fisher-folks cuss and discuss, yet I'm not sure biologically speaking that bigger flies are truly more visible to trout in ways that have a significant impact on fishing success (with some key assumptions made here, such as a trout "on station" in an eddy). The key to understanding is again, realize that our perspective is not the fish's.

I fish whatever fly I think the fish might want, without too much regard for water / fly matching.

There is one consideration for those who like to get into entomology, and that is that certain species hatch in calmer water whereas others tend to be found drifting faster water. If you look into that, you may decide to let that inform you to a degree.

[SilverCreek 0]

Hi all,

 

What defines whether a fly is to be used in slow, fast waters or whether in ripples?

 

 

Thx

Thirstea

 

 

I third the above posts.

 

In fast water, fish must seek shelter from the current so they are in hydraulic cushions. These cushions are in 4 major locations:

 

1. In front of a boulder/log

2. Behind a boulder/log

3. Next to the bank

4. On the bottom in a slight depression

 

To feed off of the surface, the cushion must also allow them to be close enough to the surface to feed before the food item is gone from their window. So if the water is much deeper than knee deep, they will not rise from the bottom of the river. This leaves the front of a boulder/log, behind a boulder/log, or next to the bank.

 

The fast flow also means the fish cannot hesitate or take time to closely examine the possible food item. This means that bushy flies that float well, foam flies, well floating impressionistic flies will work well.

 

It also means you can get closer to the fish and the riffles will obscure your casts.

 

In slow flow and especially in clear slow flows, the fish can examine the dry fly for a long time. The fish can also hold very close to the surface during hatches so their feeding window is smaller. So not only do the casts at times need to be very accurate, but the patterns also need to be more accurate in size, shape, and behavior. And you need to stay lower, move slower, and keep from lining the fish.

 

For nymphing, the fly needs to be at the level of most of the fish. This means at or near the bottom. Water at the bottom flows slower than the water at the surface and the real nymphs that the fish are eating are in or near the hydraulic cushion. The fish are also not looking at the fly through a window so they get a clearer look at the fly. If there is no hatch, they sample the drift so they will take many things into their mouths.

[thirstea 0]

That's exactly the information I was looking for.

 

What prompted the question was the many instructional videos I've seen where some end with what type of water to fish it in but there was never an explanation as to why.

 

I love this forum. 3 posts with enough information to think and work on all season.

 

Thank you!

[djtrout 0]

and to reinforce SilverCreek, it isn't about just the speed of the water. MORE important is the amount of structure available and type of stream bottom that provides pockets, and critically, the depth. Shallow fast moving water is easier to reach; in deep water you need to give more consideration for what SilverCreek mentioned, and that is the fish position and time to react to a morsel floating by.

Remember that a fish is streamlined. Although they use protective structure as security from overhead predators, and also energy conservation, they do not have difficulty holding right in the middle of current, and will do so for periods of time. I always sample the unseeming middle as well as the holding structure (besides, the unseeming middle often has holding places that are un-visible to me).

Of the slow water criteria, not lining the fish is most important to me. I just came off a trip to Elk River WV, very successful; there was one pool I was anxious to fish because it holds scads of nice fish in a relatively undisturbed area (meaning: good walk from parking access). There was already a fisherman there who had the whole pool to himself. I just had a seat, enjoyed the scenery, and watched. Not a fish in site (in this pool, it is about sight fishing) - they were hunkered down. I later learned the gentleman was new by only weeks to fly fishing, and although he had a pretty decent cast, he false casted many times right over the fish, on the final cast his line slapped the water sending ripples out. He also went first for the farthest water from his wading stance, which rendered the water right in front of him worthless (always fish carefully in front of your nose, or at least observe it before throwing the mile long cast; if you spook fish right in front of you you risk poisoning the entire pool). Anyway, the fish were hitting a small array of flies, key being smallish, but he had them hunkered down behind and under their rocks, with no interest in coming out.

On streamers, I have just one tie standard. I use cone head buggers and dumbbell clouser-style streamers with no additional weight. How I handle depth and speed is with sinking leaders, sinking tips, sinking lines, and mostly just using soft moldable lead (tungsten) weight ahead of the fly. This works well for me, but I fish such a wide variety of conditions and I just don't care to tie a fly tailored for weight to every condition; some fishermen do. By the way, I used a sinking leader for the first time on this Elk River trip and I think it is quite nice for small-medium size streams.

[SilverCreek 0]

and to reinforce SilverCreek, it isn't about just the speed of the water. MORE important is the amount of structure available and type of stream bottom that provides pockets, and critically, the depth. Shallow fast moving water is easier to reach;

 

DJ raises an important point.

 

Riffle water that is mid-calf to knee deep is a great place for a beginner to catch fish.

 

Riffles are the food factories of a river. The water is highly oxygenated. The water is not so deep so all the light can reach the bottem. The riffles indicate a cobbled bottom where aquatic insects can hide. The water is shallow enough everywhere so the fish can rise and take a fly on the surface.

 

Put on an attractor like a size 14 Royal Wullff, or a more imitative fly like a parachute Adam or an Elk Hair Caddis that imitates the local hatch. You won't know exaclty know where the fish will be in riffles so create a mental grid of the water. Then "shotgun" by fanning casts into each grid location so you systematically cover the water.

[portlyjoe 0]

THIS WAS AWESOME! i'M SO GLAD I READ THIS. THANK YOU ALL.