Alex C. 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2005 I am trying to create a hellgramite pattern and need to know how they move around underwater so I can use the right materials. Do they swim like a wiggler, or do they dart through the water, or something else?, if they swim around at all If they don't swim whats the best presentation for them? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cornmuse 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2005 Hellgramites hunt by crawling around the crevices of rocks and capturing nymphs and fry. They are vicious predators. They don't swim well at all - take one off the bottom and drop it in shallow, clear water and you'll see it corkscrew and wiggle as it tries to regain the bottom where it will immediately dissappear amongst the rocks. My favorite imitation is a black bead-head Murray's strymph - the ostrich herl tail holds together in the water and moves as a unit. You could also do okay with a simple rabbit strip matuka with lead eyes so it rides upside down. Don't get caught up in trying to imitate the mandibles - they are not prominent when the hellgramite is at rest. Also, don't try to imitate a billion legs like some ties - it may be fishy but its not accurate. A hellgramite has six powerful legs used for crawling and holding - not swimming. They are short and not really important (well, maybe to the hellgramite ). Its that wiggling that is important - that and the affinity for the bottom. Also, many hellgramite patterns are black. I can't speak for every area of the country but here in Ohio all the hellgramites I've ever seigned were a dark olive-brown just like the bottom substrate. They also have a bit of translucence. I hope this helps. Joe C. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alex C. 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2005 So when they crawl do they move like a centipede or do they kind of slither? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cornmuse 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2005 QUOTE (skunked @ Mar 18 2005, 02:51 PM) So when they crawl do they move like a centipede or do they kind of slither? More of a snake-like slither. Under water they're weightless, of course, so its almost a combination of the two. JC Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sandflyx 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2005 hows this!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted March 18, 2005 I spent most of my life fishing live hellgrammites for Smallies. They defiently don't swim well and in fact most of the time if you drop them in the water they will curl up in a little ball and sink to the bottom. I agree with Joe, there is no need to imitate the mandibles. In fact I think the rubber mandibles on Murray's Hellgrammite is a joke(that's just my opinion). To get the action that I am looking for I usually use a rabbit strip tail. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mozes 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 How can you put that on a hook . Just looking at the picture of one makes hairs on the back of my neck stand up. I would be afraid to touch that thing! With your 2'9" (per your avatar) you must be more of a man than I'm. . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steeldrifter 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 Mozes, Will is use to touching small ugly little things Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Report post Posted March 19, 2005 You can ask my father I use to have nightmare about them things when I was a kid. I grew up seining them out of the creek, and there is nothing scarier than a sein with about 50 of them bastards crawling around. They will draw blood if they get ahold of ya Steve, you told me it was cute Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taxon 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 QUOTE (skunked @ Mar 18 2005, 11:18 AM) I am trying to create a hellgramite pattern and need to know how they move around underwater so I can use the right materials. Do they swim like a wiggler, or do they dart through the water, or something else?, if they swim around at all If they don't swim whats the best presentation for them? Skunked- Hellgrammites (dobsonfly larvae) crawl by rapidly hitching themselves backward with two pairs of hooks attached to their terminal abdominal segment. They are also capable of swimming, both forward and backward, with a sort of undulating motion. They are extremely flat in profile, so might want to take that into consideration when fabricating your imitations. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sandflyx 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 a cousin of the hellgramite.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishyfranky 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 I read that the woolly bugger is supposed to be a hellgrammite I'm gonna try french braiding the marabou to get that flat undulating profile and see if it works any better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Houdini 0 Report post Posted March 19, 2005 Take a look at http://www.flytyingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=7583&hl= before you go to a lot of effort. This fly is about the most effective one I've used. I tie them weighted and unweighted. They are now my goto fly in streams and rivers and they work on trout as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flyweaver 0 Report post Posted March 22, 2005 We used Hellgramites as bait when we were kids,on more than one occasion the hellgramite caught the fish by the mouth.They were big and nasty,still are! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bigbender 0 Report post Posted March 23, 2005 My grandfather and father had me picking helgramites and crayfish out of seine nets since I've been old enough to walk in the river. That was about 40 years ago and I gather them now without a net but I'm still careful when I grab a hold of one. I've never had them draw blood but you think they're going to because they can pinch down on you pretty hard. It's always a surprise when they get you. My father's gone now, but when I saw Smalliehunter's comment about his dad, it put a smile on my face. Here's why.... If you've never seen one, adult helgramites (Dobson Fly) grow wings and fly around. After dark in mid to late summer, they get real active and you can't see them without a light. They fly around and just land on something and it's usually on your face or on the back of your neck and immediately, they start crawling around. Right before they land, you can hear their wings flutter but by then it's too late To this day, having one of them land on me always makes me jump. When my dad and I were in the boat together, he would laugh so hard at me that the boat would shake. I sure miss those fishing trips with him because he'd always remind me to "keep an eye out". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites