Shifting gears to freshwater bass....HELP!

[mikechell 0]

Go for the grass carp and hang on.

I was under the impression that Grass Carp were just that ... vegetarians. I didn't know you could target them with flies. You have some pictures of what you're catching them on?

[rstaight 0]

One thing to remember, when you were fishing for trout if you tried to set the hook to soon and missed you would likely put that fish in hiding for awhile. With bass, largemouth and smallmouth throw it back at them. You probably made him mad and he will try even harder.

[mikechell 0]

Learn to strip set, if you don't do that already. Miss a hook set, just leave it there and get ready for a second hit.

 

However, if the fish felt the hook point, you'll likely not get a second chance for several minutes. Bass will "hunker down", too.

If something "bites" them, they'll leave it alone for a while. I've had bass hit a fly within seconds of being released ... but I've also had a bass refuse to hit anything until I've ran out of patience and moved on.

 

Trout aren't "smarter", they're just spookier and, in some cases, more pressured than bass.

[Dave G. 0]

Mike, you need to get someplace where there is big brown trout fishing going on. It might not change your mind but it will make you wonder a bit. They get way more specific about the feeding roster than any bass I ever fished for. It gets real dicey when a big brown sticks his head out and looks at the fly to turn away. What did it not like about the fly. Since they supposedly can't reason then what put it down ? When any trout is feeding on size 20 flies and they don't seem to want anything on your vest or in your cases till you put on that size 20 trico or midge, you gotta wonder. Line shy is another matter, bass don't know what that is. Sometimes it seems like trout do. These phenomenon are real, however the trout works.

 

 

"Trout aren't "smarter", they're just spookier and, in some cases, more pressured than bass."

[mikechell 0]

Dave, I have no doubt that the trout are harder to catch. There are plenty of threads attesting to that. I don't want to start the "which fish is smarter" argument ...

But there are many threads, on this site, where people have posted pictures, and talked about catching big trout all day long.

I believe it's more a matter of pressure and conditioning than intelligence.

 

When I got out of the Corps, I visited my Dad in Wyoming. We fished a stretch of water called, "The Miracle Mile", which I believe was the tail water of the Alcoa Dam. When we arrived, there were about 15 anglers up and down the banks. The ones who did talk to us were telling us they weren't doing any good.

 

Dad didn't fish, just just watched me. I didn't have a fly rod, but instead was using a spinning rod with a white "Shyster". (For the other thread, yes, I have used spinners in the past). A started casting to the upstream side of boulders were no one was fishing and proceeded to catch trout. I caught four Brown Trout (one of which we kept) and more than a dozen 12 to 16 inch Rainbows(also keeping just one).

My experience that day was that Trout are no harder to catch than Bluegill or Bass if you present the right bait to the right area.

Dad and I were the only two on the bank when we left. everyone else had already packed up and gone. (No, I didn't intrude on any of them ... they just left)

 

I keep seeing people talk about how easy it is to catch Bluegill (sunfish). And it's true, if all you're targeting are 4 or 5 inch fish ... like catching Brookies in a small stream. But if you want to catch 10 to 12 inch Bluegill or larger, you have to be as careful in your approach, as accurate in your casting and as true to pattern as any other "trophy" sized fish.

[josephcsylvia 0]

Mike, you need to get someplace where there is big brown trout fishing going on. It might not change your mind but it will make you wonder a bit. They get way more specific about the feeding roster than any bass I ever fished for. It gets real dicey when a big brown sticks his head out and looks at the fly to turn away. What did it not like about the fly. Since they supposedly can't reason then what put it down ? When any trout is feeding on size 20 flies and they don't seem to want anything on your vest or in your cases till you put on that size 20 trico or midge, you gotta wonder. Line shy is another matter, bass don't know what that is. Sometimes it seems like trout do. These phenomenon are real, however the trout works.

 

 

 

"Trout aren't "smarter", they're just spookier and, in some cases, more pressured than bass."

I agree and disagree with this statement heres why.

 

ok lets take that unusually large brown trout your talking about yes they are very picky and turn down alot of flies, why? well they probably have seen enough naturals in there life to know when something isnt perfect.

 

the disagree part is you cant compare a trophy rainbow to just any bass you have to compare it to a trophy sized fish say 10lbs plus, they are just as picky as that big brown. for the same reasons, as these fish get larger they "learn" what they probably should stay away from. Same with big blue gill and so on.

 

so I think its fair to say that one species isnt necessarily easier to catch just easier to fish for.

 

and the day seems to matter alot, I fish a very small pond about 100' across and 30' long one day I caught 53 bass the next skunked with the same fly, thats fishing lol

 

with trout fishing I think more people catch less fish because of bad presentation, not because the trout is smarter Line shyness might just be bass mistaking the line for vegetation laying on the water which is normal where bass live.

 

Id bet every dollar I had if you could find a trout stream that hasnt been fished hard at all you would have a blast catching fish all day

[Dave G. 0]

If I haven't learned anything else in bass fishing, and compared to you guys who obviously do bass fishing more than I do I won't claim to know nearly enough, it is that bass are picky about weather changes. Most fish are to some degree but to me bass really get put down on weather fronts. Some fronts being the very one that turns a trout feeding frenzy on.

 

And Joe, the key to big bass is simple around here. Those live 8" bluegill Mike mentioned ? Put him on a hook and chuck it out there !!!! LOL. Perch too. Except that I am not into live bait fishing personally. And yes, I'm over simplifying the matter but I've seen this work.

 

And yes Mike, there is something to be said about just throwing something different and in a different presentation. That switch up can change things up, I've done it myself. It's especially effective in rivers.

[josephcsylvia 0]

yes that bluegill would certainly work lol weather is a huge factor in all fishing and I havnt exactly figured it out yet.

 

the difference between the two days i was mentioning above was water lever it was about 4 inches higher the second trip and I couldnt buy a bite.

[Cold 0]

I think that, all else equal, bass are more..."open minded" than trout. That is, they're more easily persuaded to put their predator instinct in the drivers seat and ignore their prey/self-preservation instinct.

 

I think that some of this, especially for LMB, is diversity of diet, compared to a trout which tends to more easily get in a mindset where it is keyed in on one thing, to the exclusion of all or most others.

 

Obviously it won't hold true in every case, but over a large enough sample set, I think you'd see it borne out.

 

I also agree that bass tend to be every bit as weather-dependent as trout, often having their "on" and "off" conditions being the opposite of what you'd expect with trout. Where a rainbow in a stream might love a weak cold front in September, the same gentle front at the same time might put down 95% of the bass. Likewise where a 10 day heat wave in July might have the trout hovering over seeps not even thinking about food, your LMB will still crush topwater stuff at dusk and dawn with reckless abandon.

 

I've found bass to be especially sensitive to water temperature changes, specifically colder. A big storm that clouds up the river and raises it a few inches to a few feet will likely have the bass off their routine until it clears up. Trout in the same river will often feed right through the high water event.

[mikechell 0]

weather is a huge factor in all fishing and I havnt exactly figured it out yet.

Joseph ... Florida bass, in my experience are a bit different to Northern varieties.

When a weather front seems to have put them off their feed ... just slow down.

When I have a guest fishing with me, and the bite is off ... this is my advice ...

1) Cast out to your target.

2) Wait for the fly/lure to hit the bottom.

3) If it wasn't taken on the fall, wait.

4) Wait until you can't stand it, THEN count to 30.

5) When you get to 30, twitch the fly/lure.

6) Repeat steps 2 through 6 until the fly/lure is directly beneath the boat, then return to step 1.

 

You cannot fish too slowly for Florida Bass ... but you can easily fish too fast.

[josephcsylvia 0]

Thanks Mike im not fishing slow enough in that situation. I know im not getting to the bottom

[mikechell 0]

I don't fly fish in anything deeper than 6 feet, maybe 7. Deeper than that and I am using a weightless, soft plastic, stick bait.

 

Shallower than 6 feet, I use a leader long enough to reach the bottom while not taking the floating fly line too deep. That little tic on the line tells you to tighten up and set the hook.

 

Either way, with cold temps or cold fronts ... slooooooooooooooooooooooow is the way to go.

[IgotWood 0]

Guy, I really appreciate the info! Thanks! There are many opportunities in VA, however, I think the LMB scene will be the most convenient, and most frequent for me. I do plan on taking advantage of some of the trout fishing in western VA, but it's hours from where I'll be living.

 

Do any of you fish at night for LMB? To be honest, the only daytime fishing I ever do is for trout.

[mikechell 0]

That's another avenue I've only tried a couple of times. Supposedly, here in Florida, night fishing for bass is productive. Not by my experience. My most memorable was being on Lake Monroe from about 2 AM to a little after dawn. The "blind mosquitoes" were so thick, it sounded like I was in a bee hive.

My total catch for being out there all that time ... none. I didn't even get a hit.

I catch more fish from 10 AM to 4 PM than any other time of the day.

[WVUontheFLY 0]

Also one species no one has mentioned yet, the muskellunge. You will be moving to a premier state musky fishery, if you have been fishing in the mangroves for bigger snook and tarpon you probably already have a 9 or 10 wt. The fight isn't the greatest but watching a fish inhale a fly boat side, or feet if wading, is the biggest rush.