Mess'o'hackle

[Bimini15 0]

Some people on this forum tie ridiculously clean flies in size 12 and smaller hooks. Just have to check the recent posts in the September flies thread.

 

I want to know how they do it. I realize that good pictures reflect well on the work, but there has to be more to it. Any secrets so that the hackle does not wrap on itself?

 

This is as good as it gets for me on a #12 hook.

 

[SilverCreek 0]

Whenever you wrap a thread around a hook, it makes a twist fir every rotation around the hook. So you need to pass the hackle from hand to hand or use a hackle plier that spins to remove the twist as the hackle winds around the fly. That is why hackle pliers have loops or a bearing system to spin. I suspect that you may not be removing the twist as you wrap the hackle.

 

See how the bearing system in the hackle plier below keeps the hackle from twisting.

 

 

 

Go to the site below and you will see how the rotating pliers keeps the hackle from twisting.

 

https://thefeatherbender.com/2013/02/12/fly-tying-course-6-dry-fly-hackle-prep-and-traditional-dry-fly/

 

Or in the video below, the tier transfers the hackle from hand to hand to keep it from twisting.

 

 

Or in this video, the tier transfers a non gimbaled hackle pliers from hand to hand top keep the hackle from twisting.

 

[Cold 0]

.

[Hatchet Jack 0]

Last year I bought a few "Whiting 100" packs of hackle and I could not believe the difference

in how the barbules of those hackles layed out on the hook shank, compared to my ~ #2 grade

hackle necks. All the difference in the world. You might want to try these hackles.

 

Another thing (and I'm not quite sure how to word this) is to have a wee bit of bare hackle stem showing,

once the hackle is tied into place and is ready for wrapping. That little section of bare stem lays down

around the hook shank first, and sets things up nicely for the barbules that will follow.

[flytire 0]

I want to know how they do it.

 

practice practice practice

[phg 0]

Good quality hackle, properly sized hackle, and, yes, lots of practice. I find that holding even tension while I wind is important as anything else. That's one of the reasons why I like my rotary vise. It makes it much easier to hold the hackle in the proper position as you wind.

 

Then again, there are some hackles that just insist on twisting as you wind....

[Bimini15 0]

Thanks for the replies.

 

The hackle is actually not that poor quality. It is Keough's Grade 1, but it is not the first time someone mentions it, and it is old. I have nothing to compare and tell how good a shape it is in. The barbs, while bent on the picture, are actually quite stiff.

 

I think you got it right on practice, practice, practice. I just tend to quickly tie what I need when I need it. I am learning that I enjoy trying new things, but I do not give it enough time to develop the tecnique.

[Bruce Norikane 0]

Some people on this forum tie ridiculously clean flies in size 12 and smaller hooks. Just have to check the recent posts in the September flies thread.

 

I want to know how they do it. I realize that good pictures reflect well on the work, but there has to be more to it. Any secrets so that the hackle does not wrap on itself?

 

Don't worry about the perfect flies on this forum. Few of us can match them.

 

When a new technique doesn't look right, break it down and focus on the details. Find a good SBS or video that really illustrates the technique. Try to follow that tutorial exactly. It may take a few tries, but you should see improvement. With fly tying, the devil is often in the details.

 

BTW - a great photo shows all the flaws in magnificent detail. A fly will look terrific on my vise, but blown up 20 times on screen, uh, not so much.

 

[brooktrout308 0]

The only thing I could think of that I don't think was disused was to make sure you don't over wrap the hackle keep it tight one right tight in front of the previous one, the better grade hackle the more barbes per inch which translates into less needed wraps.

[Cold 0]

.

[Bimini15 0]

Bruce,

You are right... That is a horrible fly!

Thanks for the advice.

 

Cold,

What is the approximate "best before" date for hackle to get brittle? This is probably 8 years old.

I am asking because every now and then I do choose one hackle that will break often, while another will not break at all. Same little 'ole me tying, same fly.

Will steaming it restore some properties?

 

Brook,

That is entirely possible. Not used to size 12 hooks, I wrapped about 6 turns. In retrospect that sounds like too many.

[phg 0]

Eight years isn't all that old, but, if you have stored the hackle in a dry environment, it may turn brittle. Keough is pretty good hackle. I have a couple of his capes that are at least that old, and they still work fine. I find I prefer Collins' hackles, but mostly for the natural colors and textures.

 

Steaming may help, by restoring some of the moisture. Storage in an air tight container will also help. I keep mine in plastic bins, but then, I live in a high humidity area, so mold is a bigger problem than drying out...(OK, I'm joking, I've never had any of my tying materials mold. )

 

The size of the hook makes surprisingly little difference. That is because smaller hackles have smaller stems and finer barbs. As a general rule, I wind 2 full wraps behind the wing and 3 in front. That's considered "heavy", though, which works well here in the SE where we have a lot of high gradient streams. A classic Catskill would be 1.5 turns behind and 2 in front, more appropriate for flat water or light currents.

 

When I step down to a size 18 or 20, I'll try to reduce the number of turns, but 12, 14 & 16 I treat the same.

[flytire 0]

I have 30+ year old hackles that are still good to tie with and dont break

[Dave G. 0]

I have 25 yo hackle that is still good, or as good as it ever was. But if your stems are a little stiff or brittle then yes steaming may help.

 

Bimini, really watch your hackle go on the hook, make sure you tie it in properly so the barbs go on aligned and not facing forward and backward on the hook at the same time, usually this means tying the hackle in flat, then as you rotate them onto the hook shank they turn into alignment. There are many videos you can watch on tying in hackles. Things like shiny side out or dull side out for if you want the barbs to sweep back or forward etc. if your feather turns over on you as you wrap you will get weird patterns in the fly of barbs crossing over one another. And as mentioned, make sure you wrap forward without crossing over the last wrap..

 

Six turns is probably not too many, I often put in three turns behind a wing and two to four in front, depending on the hackle. Whiting does pack a few more barbs into an inch of feather but you just wrap in what it takes is all. I've gone sever to even nine turns between two different colored feathers on feathers that were kind of sparse.. I've seen some videos where guys have put on like 11 turns it seems on some larger flies where they really want the hackle to fill out and be buoyant..

[Cold 0]

.