Dry Fly Tail Sinking

[1hook 0]

So I got some nice Indian rooster capes and have been tying sulphers with them. I wanted to see how well the Indian cape floated so I dropped it into a sink full of water.

 

When the fly was dropped into water the hackle part of the fly floated fine but the tail would go right through the surface tension and sink.

I was tailing the fly with spade hackle from one of my genetic capes as I normally do.

 

If I gently laid the fly into the water then it floated fine, tail and all.

 

I would say I use about a half dozen fibers for my tail... size 14, standard mustad dry fly hook.

 

My question is, what can I do to get my tail to float better without adding a lot more fibers? I tried to put some Gink on it and it did the same thing. Like I said it floated fine if gently placed in water. It if dropped it would sink. I would think being dropped would be more closer to how it will work when fishing

[McGnat 0]

Try putting a little spread in the tail fibers. After your starting wrap, press down on the fibers with your fingernail until you get the spread you want, then finish the tie in.

[rotaryflytyingdotcom 0]

1hook there are a couple of things you can try.

 

1) When you tie the Spade hackle tailing material onto the hook make an extra wrap or two of tying thread - under the tail material instead of over it. Pull the wraps in tight under the tailing material and that will cause the 1/2 dozen or so fibers to splay out into a fan shape. You can even run you thumbnail up under the tail fiber and push against the fibers to splay them more. The spread fibers will support the hook better than a single clump of fibers.

 

2) Make your tails longer than normal. Most dry fly guides call for a tail length equal to the hook shank. Make your tails longer, say, one and one-half the shank length. If you're going to cheat anywhere to get a better floating fly there is no place better to cheat than at the tail of the fly.

Remember the guides are just that - guides. There are drawbacks to over-hackling or making wings too long but little to no drawback to a longer tail. What little drawback there might be is easily offset by the increased buoyancy you gain.

[1hook 0]

Good call on the longer tails.. will have to try that. I currently do put a wrap under the tail fibers to spread so I don't think it's that.

 

I wonder if they will perform differently on the water vs in my sink... I've not really noticed my flies tails sinking while fishing

[Bryon Anderson 0]

If you tie your dry flies parachute style, the tail becomes a non-issue.

[Flat Rock native 0]

Good call on the longer tails.. will have to try that. I currently do put a wrap under the tail fibers to spread so I don't think it's that.

I wonder if they will perform differently on the water vs in my sink... I've not really noticed my flies tails sinking while fishing

I use polyolefin (macreme) Yarn, alone or mixed with hackle fibres, to make hook bend a bit more buoyant..

[SilverCreek 0]

There are 3 main methods for spreading the tails on dry flies. They are the dubbing ball, thread method and the Hockley method,

 

FAOL explains the dubbing ball and one way to use thread to split the tails,

 

http://flyanglersonline.com/flytying/beginners/part16.php

 

There are other methods to use a thread to split the tail.

 

Al Beatie has described a method. After you have put the thread on the hook, and cut off the thread end, put it aside. Tie an even number of micro fibbets on the hook, and do a crude split of the fibers. Then take the short piece of cut thread, and make a "U" with it around the bottom of hook bend and slide the U so the thread separates the fibers to each side of the hook. Then tie the thread ends down over the top of the hook.

When tying spinner patterns, use a piece of fluorescent yellow or green floss to split the tail. The floss tag imitates the egg sac on a female spinner.

Another method is to take one thread wrap between the tail and hook on the far side ( as you go down higher to lower) and then back over the hook. Take the next wrap between the near side of the hook and tailing material (as you come up lower to higher) and then back over the hook.

A third method is the Hockley Tailing Method.

Bud Hockley of Baltimore Maryland devised a method of tying spit or fan tails which is both elegant and simple . This method was described in the 1985 September issue (vol 16, issue 6) of Fly Fisherman Magazine, pg 36 by none other than John Betts, the originator of microfibbets.

1. Tie an even number of Betts microfibbets or stiff hackle fibers in the usual manner and overwrap them with thread back to just before the start of the bend of the hook. Give yourself the room for two more wraps of thread before the bend starts.

2. Take a smooth dubbing needle and place it across the hook between the tails and the hook. Slide the needle toward the eye of the hook so that it lifts the tails off the hook. Now wrap two turns of thread around the dubbing needle and the hook as if you were going to tie the needle to the hook. This will slide the two turns of thread under the tail fibers. Gently pull the needle out as you tighten the thread, and guide the thread so that they lie around the hook, but under the tail fibers, and just in back of the thread wraps which tie the tail down.

3. Now take the dubbing needle and place it along side of the hook closest to you with the tip of the needle toward the eye of the hook. There should be a little space between the hook and needle to maneuver the needle. Now take the thread around the needle, and between the hook and the tails, as if you were going to tie the needle to the back of the hook. As you tighten the thread, gently remove the needle and guide the thread so that it comes to lie on top of the two wraps you place in step two. This wrap will further splay the tails from the back of the hook

4. Keep repeating step three to place multiple wraps of thread just at the base of the tails, between the tails and the hook, until the tails begin to fan and split. When you have built up the thread ball, use your fingers to even up and split the tails and elevate them if you want.

5. Now take the thread and take a couple of cross wraps around the tail to hold them in the final position.

There you have it. The Hockley method of split or fan tailing a fly without using a dubbing ball. BTW, Hockley uses it for stonefly nymphs as well as dry flies.

For a final fly tying tip, I have a cheap source for real micro fibetts. Micro fibetts are the bristles from artist brushes. That is their original source. Like many materials in fly tying, micro fibetts have been adapted from another purpose.

Wait for sale coupon for a Michaels or Joanne craft store. Both carry artist brushes that are about $5 for the beginner's brushes. With the 40 - 50% off coupon you can get then for $3 or less. Get the widest flat top brush and cut of the wooden handle. You will get micro fibetts whose tips are aligned and ready for tying in. Just cut out the number you need.

The bristles can by colored with markers but I think the tan works fine for most flies. The parachute adams has the paint brush fibetts for tail fibers, and you can see that at the the left base of the brush I have begun to cut off the fibers.

The dark tips of the fibetts really is not noticeable on the fly.

 

[McGnat 0]

I do not use a dubbing ball for split tails. I build up a bump of thread, tie in the tail a bit back of the bump, split the tail by pressing the fiber against the hook shank an then wrap back to the thread bump. Generally you have to hold the near side fibers to keep thread torque from moving them to the top of the shank instead of them staying to the side of the shank.

[Dubs 0]

For splitting the tails, I have been starting the thread, and leaving the tag on as I wrap back. Tie in tail fibers and lift the tag, splitting them. Pull the tag tight and wrap it when you like it. Anyone else do this? Can't recall where I saw this, probably a youtube

[mikechell 0]

I wonder if they will perform differently on the water vs in my sink.

Yes ... the fly will perform differently on the water, with a tippet tied to it and laid out in front of it. If you're testing your fly in the sink without any tippet, then it's completely different. If you're tying it to tippet and then holding on to the tippet, you might actually be applying "incorrect" pressure to the fly with the tippet.

Believe me ... I do NOT know how this will affect the floating of your flies, since I don't tie dries. I am just commenting on that one aspect of "testing" flies in a sink, or a glass of water.

[heavynets 0]

Would using a barbless hook or grinding off the barb to remove a little weight help?????

[1hook 0]

Thanks for the comments, Mike that's a good point you make about tippet. I think the tips on better spreading the tail will help as well

[SilverCreek 0]

Would using a barbless hook or grinding off the barb to remove a little weight help?????

 

I don't think the barb makes a difference.

[Flat Rock native 0]

 

I wonder if they will perform differently on the water vs in my sink.

 

Yes ... the fly will perform differently on the water, with a tippet tied to it and laid out in front of it. If you're testing your fly in the sink without any tippet, then it's completely different. If you're tying it to tippet and then holding on to the tippet, you might actually be applying "incorrect" pressure to the fly with the tippet.

Believe me ... I do NOT know how this will affect the floating of your flies, since I don't tie dries. I am just commenting on that one aspect of "testing" flies in a sink, or a glass of water.

Yes, this is where I use the AzzHat Tenkara rod for tank testing.... although it is a beeatch when hooking my right ear...

 

OP may not have tail sinkage issue after applying some Loon floatant on two feet of tippet above the fly...

[JSzymczyk 0]

Surface tension on a stream, river, or lake is going to be different than your tap water as well. We've all taken flies and dropped them in an aquarium, a sink, a bathtub, or swimming pool to see what they do. It's like that other thing, 90 percent have done it, the other 10 percent have lied about it. In the end, it's more or less a pointless exercise. Water chemistry is different, no physics of the cast going on, no leader, equals no sense.