Spey rod for trout, anyone here do it?

[Rocco 0]

Mike,

 

Distance is far from a secondary issue -- along with the no back cast advantage cited, it is at the core of most other long rod advantages. The long two-handers do more than just get you to the other side of the river; they offer more efficient and effective fly coverage on really long casts, require minimum casting exertion and time for increased reach, and they give more certain hook sets at long distances.. Its a package deal.

 

You can actually use spey casting techniques with one handers IF you just want to avoid obstacles to back casts. Hell, I've even been doing roll casts for decades for medium to close in work as the need arises

 

Rocco

[Dave G. 0]

Yeah I roll cast for shorter situations too. Course, knowing I have little back cast room but intend on a decent spot to fish with at least limited room vs none, I've probably walked in with one of my shorter rods. Longer rods do help the roll caster. My longest rod is 9'6" but it's a 7-8, not exactly exciting for LLS or trout. But that rod has a beefy butt section and a fighting butt on it. I bet it would spey cast with the right line on it and not break in two..

[Hatchet Jack 0]

"...Those short thicker front Skagit tapers also call for bigger diameter guides than the advertised wt of the rod would suggest..."

Rocco

 

.

Steelie, before you build your Spey rod, some subjective as hell suggestions

with respect to running guides:

 

First, settle on what line system you're going to use - head, running, backing, etc.,

then measure your widest loop-to-loop connection - use this dimension to choose guide sizes.

 

I have found that a gap of roughly 1.5 mm (minimum) on each side of the widest loop-to-loop connection allows for good line clearance, like when using MOW tips and a big fat Skagit line.

 

I went from ceramic single-foots, to Minima 4's, then finally went back to good old snake guides - these offered the best line flow and loop clearance. The loop-to-loop connections seemed to 'catch' on the other guides when fully retrieving the line, like a car wheel smacking dead on into a curb.

 

And of course, go large diameter on the tiptop. Snake Brand as you probably know has a decent length on their tiptop tube, which I really like.

 

Keep us posted on your progress, lots of us are eager to see what evolves!

[Dave G. 0]

Excuse me if this sounds idiotic but why a Skagit line for trout flies and streamers ?

 

I'm actually thinking switch rod and scandi line, is that off base ?

[Steeldrifter 0]

Skagit uses a shorter heavier type line than other styles of spey such as Scandi. Since I plan to fish streamers at shorter distances down deep skagit fits that type of fishing best. Different size/types of rivers have a style that best suits them, it's just in my case skagit seems to tick all the boxes for me.

[whatfly 0]

Excuse me if this sounds idiotic but why a Skagit line for trout flies and streamers ?

 

I'm actually thinking switch rod and scandi line, is that off base ?

 

Depending on what you want to do, maybe yes, maybe no. Type of presentation (swing v. indicator v. both) and casting proficiency are key issues as well. Not really sure there is one good answer. To complicate matters, there are lines that are a bit of both such as the Rio Switch Chucker. Skagit is a bit easier to learn, which I think explains its meteoric rise in popularity, more than any other factor.

[Dave G. 0]

Thanks guys, I don't want to hog Steve's thread, will continue researching. If I have more questions I'll start a new thread. There are a ton of videos on this stuff.

[Steeldrifter 0]

No problem Dave since I am just starting to get seriously into spey myself any info is good info so no worries about hogging the thread at all.

[Dave G. 0]

Steve, remember you gave the OK LOL !

 

Maybe I had an incorrect understanding about the Skagit, it was that it was capable of "or more capable" than some other lines in turning over heavy sinking tips and heavy flies. I suppose that isn't to say that it won't turn over lighter heads, leaders and flies, if not as gracefully.

 

That said, in spring and fall, which are high water times in a couple of pools I often get to fish then. I have a heck of a time reaching out into the middle somewhere. I end up fishing the nearer seam line and a couple of pockets and one eddy but the pool is much larger, not to mention the tail slick and riffles I can't reach at all. There is more area to be had in other words, basically doable in a drift boat. But back casting or roll casting still places my flies in about the same repeated drift lines over and over again in waders. Generally I fish wets and streamers in there and there probably isn't a lot of need to go down more than 3 ft or so. There is an under water ledge out there that the fish hang along or at the head of. The head is the hard piece to cast too and out in front of that a really deep hole where it wouldn't hurt to put out 60-70ft of line and let the fly ride up over the ledge. No can do. Another clinker in the works is if they suddenly turn on to BWO dries, there can be a hatch of those at any time.

 

My second scenario: Midge pupa, common wets , soft hackles, nymphs, buggers emergers to rising trout in a pond. Two spots are impossible casts, the fish are another 20-30 ft beyond what a conventional cast can reach because of back cover. Again, it's probably 60-70 ft or 3/4 of a conventional floating line using wt forward. I don't think this year is going to be a problem because the pond is very low, I'll be starting half way out to where the fish hold anyway, unless they move further out. But usually the water in the spring is up in the brush line. I have to find places where I can let my back cast sneak through in openings and such or bring a canoe .. And that doesn't always line up with the fish or the canoe can put them down too. Eventually a fish or two will cruise through a little closer and that is my chance . Oh and I'm probably good for a 40 ft roll cast tops, FWIW. Maybe I should just reline an existing rod for more efficient roll casting.

 

If you guys in the know about this two handed stuff were faced with what I'm describing above, what would be your weapon of choice for rod style and line type in a two handed rig ?

[Piker20 0]

You're correct that skagit will lift a deep sunk tip (not necessarily heavy) and bulky fly from down deep and fly it out with little effort. It requires a water based anchor so isn't great on shallow water or where fish may be spooked by the disturbance.

Scandi will not manage the same tip/fly combo as well but you can cast touch and go so disturb the water a lot less and the landing is more gentle as often scandi lines have gentler tapers.

 

Into a wind skagits greater mass wins

With zero room for D loop skagit wins.

For dry flies or surface/upper layer presentation scandi wins hands down.

 

As you say Dave, loads and loads written about it. If you want a line to try on a trout rated switch rod have a look at mike barrios switch lines. Very highly rated in UK and don't cost Rio prices. Although in US maybe the Rio is not expensive??

 

For your second scenario I would look at the scandi lines assuming you do have D room behind. The floating airflo rage heads with a 10ft poly leader and then your leader can present quite nicely if you control the shoot and lay it down at the end.

[Dave G. 0]

Yes Piker, there is some room behind in both situations. The slick would be tight and in one spot there could be trouble over head with overhanging tree limbs. both places can be pretty windy, I often pick my days to go by wind direction. But the river is usually directly down river or directly up river. A straight north wind at the pond forget it for this one spot. But you can hike around to the other side where a back cast is about impossible but there is a deep trough in front of you that can be awesome. But you can wade out maybe 8-10 ft and have 8-10 ft of shore behind you before the bush, so I'd think a D loop could tuck in there easy enough.

 

Do you think just based on description that either scenario is screaming for spey vs switch rod ?

 

I'm not a huge fan of Rio pricing in the US generally speaking. I usually buy something less expensive.

[heavynets 0]

Steve Rajeff can spey cast 290 ft. So your main problem, like all of us, is most likely technic. Skill wise, it sounds like I'm at about the same level as you. I've been trying to buy my way to good casting. I have spent more money trying to find that perfect line than I spent on my rod. Still trying to find line that masks my poor casting. I should have spent most of that money on lessons.

 

A couple of things that I've found that helps my distance is using mono shooting line and propper line management of that shooting line. Having it dragging in the water or knotting up as it goes through the guides really kills distance. I also plan on setting up a camera to film myself casting. I think seeing myself from different angles will help me diagnose some of my problems. Also getting that leader to the right length and stifness for my particular setup has helped too.

 

Maybe some of this will help you.

[FKROW 0]

We had a long detailed discussion on The North American Fly Fishing Forum,,, search for Trout Spey Rods Explained for the thread.

Most of the questions above are discussed in detail.

 

Regards,

FK

[Dave G. 0]

Steve Rajeff can spey cast 290 ft. So your main problem, like all of us, is most likely technic. Skill wise, it sounds like I'm at about the same level as you. I've been trying to buy my way to good casting.

heavynets, that's cool but I don't even have my first two handed fly rod yet and have never spey casted in my life as yet..

[Dave G. 0]

We had a long detailed discussion on The North American Fly Fishing Forum,,, search for Trout Spey Rods Explained for the thread.

Most of the questions above are discussed in detail.

 

Regards,

FK

Thanks I'll check that out.