Buying Deer Hair

[Microvert 0]

I read that you should never purchase late season deer hair, as it is unven and not very hollow. So, what would be the best time of year to purchase deer hair for spinning?

[mikechell 0]

Welcome to the site, Micro.

It's not a matter of when ... unless you're harvesting and tanning the hides yourself.

If you buy from a reputable dealer, then you should find quality deer hair all year long.

 

That said, early Winter time is when all Northern animals have that layer of fat and have grown their longer, heavier winter coats.

[Mark Knapp 0]

Legally harvested deer are taken in the fall. They get bought by hide buyers and get all mixed up. By the time they are processed and we buy them, we don't know if we are buying late season or early season hair.

 

I recently did a study on deer belly hair (a small study to be sure) I wanted to see where we could get the best deer belly hair. I received late season, whole hides, from Wisconsin, Minnesota and where I live, Alaska. I reasoned northern, late season hides would be best.

 

The Alaska deer were inferior by far. They had great hair but not much white belly hair. Not the right species.

 

Wisconsin and Minnesota, late season, white tails had great hair. The does were much better than the bucks with belly hair twice as long as the bucks, up to four inches long and five times the surface area of white hair than the bucks.

 

I have compared my belly hair with commercially bought hair and found it to be as thick and airy as any in my commercial samples (30 or 40 samples) None of mine is uneven.

 

But the real surprise for me was that the butt hairs on does were longer than the belly and tail hair. The part on the butt that flairs when a deer runs away from you. I found some that was between five and six inches long and whiter than the belly hair (if that's possible). Probably because the tail hair is straight and reflects more light than the curved belly hair. Butt hair is not as soft as belly hair.

 

I have tied some flies with the hair I gathered and it spins as nicely. It has no apparent difference (to me).

 

The disadvantage, of course, is that if you want colors, you would need to die it.

 

If people are interested, I can post pictures of my examples.

[Flicted 0]

Interesting findings.

 

I did not expect to read the words "butt hair" today so thanks for that.

[Mark Knapp 0]

You are welcomed. Happy to do it.

[tjm 0]

Mark that is pretty much what I thought you'd find and the early late bla-bla is unknown for the reason you stated- legal seasons which are mostly in Nov. I think. Supposedly tied to the rut, though it doesn't work that way on my patch. I would be skeptical of anyone purporting to have deer products harvested at blabla time of year. (although bow killed deer could be from Sept through Jan in some places)

What I would expect as the biggest difference between La. deer and Mn. deer would be more wool in the northern deer, length of hair might be the same but I'd expect northern animals to produce more underfur.(given same species and other factors equal)

 

And on the when to buy, as Mike said from reputable dealer anytime is the right time, the hair you buy may be years old by the time it moves through the supply chain.

[Mark Knapp 0]

tjm, you know, that's pretty funny. I didn't notice more wool in the late northern deer than I remember on any other deer. I wasn't paying attention but I think I would have noticed if it was much different. I will make a note to check it out next time I'm into the deer hair

[utyer 0]

Watch this video on selecting deer hair from Kelly Galloup. After that, you will know how to select good hair for your needs. Hair should be one thing you get in person.

[flytire 0]

https://globalflyfisher.com/tie-better/selecting-deer-hair

[Mark Knapp 0]

That's a good video. I guess it would depend on what you call "late season" My hides were taken in late November. My other question is, if you can comb out the fur, or under fur, is there a difference in the hair that remains?

[Mark Knapp 0]

Norm's article from Global Fly casters is pretty interesting too. In some places the video and the article seem to contradict each other (I'll have to look at them again) I think I'll cut up the two remaining hides I have and label the pieces for where they came from and see if these things make a big difference to me.

 

I, recognize for me, as much as any body and more than most, that it's easy to overthink these things. If one specialized in deer hair flies the subtle differences in hair would be a bigger deal than if you just used it when called for in a broad array of patterns.

[DarrellP 0]

Now my wife asked what I was reading about. I said a guy in Alaska is studying the difference in thickness and coarseness in butt hair and belly hair. She found that odd.

[SilverCreek 0]

I read that you should never purchase late season deer hair, as it is unven and not very hollow. So, what would be the best time of year to purchase deer hair for spinning?

 

Well, you kind of have it mixed up. Deer and Elk Hair grows longer during the hunting season. So or the length of the HOLLOW section of hair that you use for spinning gets longer on later season deer.

For tying EHCs and Comparaduns, you want early season hair.

To understand deer hair lets look at the images below.

First are three patches of hair from left to right are bleached blond deer hair, light deer and dark deer hair. Then a close up of a patch. Then an EHC tied with Deer Hair.

 

 

Here is a close up of a patch.

 

 

Here is tied fly

 

 

 

What I want you to notice is best seen on the fly above. Notice that the hair has a black tips. This section of black is SOLID and will not flair. Then there is a section of light hair which becomes hollow and then the rest of the hair body is darker and completely hollow.

As the hair grow during the fall and into winter, ALL the hair gets longer, including the black tips, pale section and dark body. Not all the hair grows at the same rate so the where the color “breaks” on the hide between the black tips, pale section and dark body becomes irregular.

In fact you can see the the “jagged” color breaks in all the patches in the first photo and the close up second photo. This is important for flies such as Elk Hair Caddis and Comparaduns where the hair is used as wings because we want the even tips so the wings look even.

Look at the first comparadun fly below. Then look at the second fly. Unless the black tips are the SAME length, the wing will look irregular because the color break will look irregular. The first fly has more regular tips and the wing has a more defined profile.

So for tying wings, whether on EHCs or Comparaduns/Sparkleduns, the using early season hair with shore black even tips is important for good looking wings.

Here are photos of my personal hair. This is macro photo so the hair length is short. Note the very short black tips. This is what you want for EHC and Comparaduns/Sparkleduns

For more information see my post below which explains some of the same material but also how to GRADE and BUY hair.

http://www.flytyingforum.com/index.php?showtopic=69829&st=0&p=522278

[Mark Knapp 0]

Darrell, that's actually quite common. Lots of folks find some of what I do odd, especially the women.

 

SilverCreek, thanks for the info. Things are a little clearer for me now. It depends on what flies you want to tie.

 

My interest was mainly in where to find the best belly hair, or white hair. What you are saying seems to agree with what I learned. The longer hair and greater quantity of hair came from late season, northern deer (does, not bucks).

 

As for what what hair is best for which flies, I will leave that up to you experts and hopefully learn some from you. I'll watch for those differences in hair as I go forward. Noe I understand the "uneven-ness" thing. Thanks for taking the time.