Continuation...... HELP finishing first nymph

[eric_sthjrsy 0]

All,

 

the other day you all posted some pretty good advice about going to a smaller size thread and not crowding the eye so much in order to finish my first nymph ithout the whip knot falling over the hook eye. All of this helped tremendously (I went to a UTC 70 denier and left 2 hook eye's worth of room behind the eye), HOWEVER, I just tried whip finishing another one and the thread slipped over the eye (not by much at all). I am guessing with practice this will go away. MY QUESTION: is once this last slip happened, I rotated the vice/ fly 180 deg (so it was upside down and then whip finished the fly. This created a v-notch (between the hook eye and shank) allowing the thread I was whip finishing to ride in that v notch and not slip.

 

Does anyone see any issues In doing this? It seemed a lot easier to finish for me....

[riffleriversteelheadslayer 0]

I'm thinking its not the hook angle as much as the tension on your thread or more specifically the direction of the tension on your whip

my guess is you are keeping tension on your thread downward but not enough towards the rear of the fly

[Dcap240 0]

Rif has a good point. You should be keeping tension on your bobbin rearward of the fly. Also your whip finish should start at the eye and wrap back away from the eye so your last wrap is behind the others not on top of each other or back to front. Keep tension on the thread the whole time through you whip so the thread can't move. It's hard to figure out what you are doing wrong without seeing you do it. The only other things I can recommend you try is spin your bobbin a little to twist the thread before you whip and maybe a little wax on the thread ( just rub a little dubbing type wax on your finger tips then rub it on an inch or two of the thread that is hanging from your bobbin) just a little to help the thread from sliding. If you leave enough room behind the hook eye and you keep tension on the thread it really can't slip over the eye because the eye is thicker then the shank and the thread will butt up against the eye. Make sense?

[shoebop 0]

Also, if you find you have crowed the eye a bit too much try just pinching with your fingernails just behind the eye. In most cases this will push the thread wraps back away from the eye just enough.

 

BTW, you will need strong fingernails for this technique

[utyer 0]

The best way to learn the whip finish is BEFORE you tie any fly at all. Start your thread, bring the thread back about a quarter inch. Then take the thread back up to one eye width back of the eye. NOW do a whip finish. Repeat this process a dozen time until you can do it without thinking about it. Once you can do the whip finish, with the tool, then learn to do the same thing WITHOUT the tool.

 

A simple knot you can use without any tools is Borger's Double Hitch. The step by step in the link should make it easy. I use all three knots at different times.

 

Just take a few minutes and learn these finish knots before you go on, it will make tying easier.

[nick2011 0]

it is also possible that you are building the head up too much, and the eye off the hook can no longer hold the thread back, you should post a picture of your fly to give us all a better idea of how your fly looks

[UpstateFlyTyer 0]

I tend to agree with all said above. I just want to emphasize that what it sounds like your biggest problem is the dircection of tension. When you are whip finishing, pull the finishing tool back towards the rear of the hook, keeping constant tension, and start wrapping back down the hok shank. Then, even after you "pop" the thread of the tool keep the tool pulled rearward as much as possible. Hope this helps!

[phg 0]

...but to your question, turning the fly over to whip finish is fine. I've resorted to that, on occasion, when I've crowded the eye and don't want to retie the fly.

 

I think FlyTyer is right, though, that the angle is the problem. That just takes practice. A few hundred flies, and you'll be fine.

[eric_sthjrsy 0]

 

phg,

 

Appreciate that, although I will take everyone's input and try to use it, I just wanted to know whether that is even acceptable to turn the fly over.

 

To all the others, I will post some pics of the flies I am tying on the site this weekend for critique, but in reality these are only the first dozen or two that I am working on so I expect to run into these types of problems. As far as practicing the whip finish, I have done this and feel I can do it fairly decent for my beginning stages..... however it is a different ball game when there is actually material next to the hook eye.... again I think most of you are right it will just take a few hundred flies to get past this... which I am looking forward to the practice. Just ordered a few hundred hooks in various sizes and beads to go with it.... should be a fun winter over here in Germany. thanks again!