WWKimba 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 I normally just ignore the JC if called for - my flies will NEVER be framed (except maybe for a crime against fly tying!). I have used UNtreated starling and guinea feathers but that's it. I find the fish still laugh at the tie either way. Kim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamieofthenorth 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 I have some of those plastic-y fake jungle cock feathers... they are pretty cheap looking and not really worth it, IMO. Tied a few flies with them and it immediately sparked a memory of when I was a little kid and my mom would buy some supermarket brand knockoff of my favorite cereal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cphubert 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 Jungle cock substitutes lack the natural UV reflectivity of the feather (jungle cock, peacock and some other birds have a high natural UV refection) I have always believed that was the reason they are effective. I would rather omit it in a pattern than use any plastic nail, but making substitutes from feathers.... Starling tip's substituted will tie jassid's you can find some of the wing coverts longer and wider for other uses. I have seen hand painted hackles that looked good, also guinea fowl substitutes, dyed and/or painted or not. The point being use your imagination with feathers and materials, that is part of the craft of tying. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
niveker 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 43 minutes ago, cphubert said: The point being use your imagination with feathers and materials, that is part of the craft of tying. I don't think this point can be over-stressed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DFoster 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 41 minutes ago, cphubert said: Jungle cock substitutes lack the natural UV reflectivity of the feather (jungle cock, peacock and some other birds have a high natural UV refection) I have always believed that was the reason they are effective. I would rather omit it in a pattern than use any plastic nail, but making substitutes from feathers.... Starling tip's substituted will tie jassid's you can find some of the wing coverts longer and wider for other uses. I have seen hand painted hackles that looked good, also guinea fowl substitutes, dyed and/or painted or not. The point being use your imagination with feathers and materials, that is part of the craft of tying. I posted a little while ago that I've been using Starling tips as a JC sub as in this Golden Ace below. To my eye the green/blue iridescence of the starling works in place of JC well enough to catch fish, a stickler for tradition would argue the point. Every fly I tie I expect to cast and as long as it fools the fish I'm ok with variants. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cphubert 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 10 minutes ago, DFoster said: green/blue iridescence of the starling works lackwell Publishing Ltd Studies on UV reflection in feathers of some 1000 bird species: are UV peaks in feathers correlated with violet-sensitive and ultraviolet-sensitive cones? PETER MULLEN* & GEORG POHLAND Alexander Koenig Zoological Research Museum, Leibniz Institute for Terrestrial Biodiversity, Research Group: Biology and Phylogeny of Tropical Birds, Adenauerallee 160, 53113 Bonn, Germany Starlings are known to have high reflectivity. I should have read page 1 before posting. Welcome to the site Fisherman Johnny, I hope you enjoy the forum and please let us know if you do find something better, the sharing of information and ideas is the Fly Tying Forum's best feature. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DFoster 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 3 hours ago, cphubert said: lackwell Publishing Ltd Studies on UV reflection in feathers of some 1000 bird species: are UV peaks in feathers correlated with violet-sensitive and ultraviolet-sensitive cones? PETER MULLEN* & GEORG POHLAND Alexander Koenig Zoological Research Museum, Leibniz Institute for Terrestrial Biodiversity, Research Group: Biology and Phylogeny of Tropical Birds, Adenauerallee 160, 53113 Bonn, Germany Starlings are known to have high reflectivity. I should have read page 1 before posting. Welcome to the site Fisherman Johnny, I hope you enjoy the forum and please let us know if you do find something better, the sharing of information and ideas is the Fly Tying Forum's best feature. LOL- I didn't know myself- To my eye they just look good! Another reason the Stewart's Black Spider is effective I guess. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WWKimba 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 6 hours ago, niveker said: I don't think this point can be over-stressed. Will all of us that have modified a pattern to match the materials we have on hand please raise their hand...................................................................................................this will take a while! Kim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sandan 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 31 minutes ago, WWKimba said: Will all of us that have modified a pattern to match the materials we have on hand please raise their hand...................................................................................................this will take a while! Kim 🖐️ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WWKimba 0 Report post Posted February 26, 2021 ONE! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scarface Z 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2021 I like the look of a ringneck pheasant flank feather trimmed up, though it is a bit limited in the colors of fly it works with. I've been meaning to try slicking it back with something for smaller flies. Here's an example of one dyed yellow. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamieofthenorth 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2021 20 minutes ago, Scarface Z said: I like the look of a ringneck pheasant flank feather trimmed up, though it is a bit limited in the colors of fly it works with. I've been meaning to try slicking it back with something for smaller flies. Here's an example of one dyed yellow. That looks great! Nice workaround! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DFoster 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2021 3 hours ago, Scarface Z said: I like the look of a ringneck pheasant flank feather trimmed up, though it is a bit limited in the colors of fly it works with. I've been meaning to try slicking it back with something for smaller flies. Here's an example of one dyed yellow. Great idea! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SalarMan 0 Report post Posted March 2, 2021 Hmmm...... Subs for JC make it difficult to really duplicate "that look" of the enameled eye. The feathers from a starling with the white dot can be dyed light orange then you simply put on a very thin coat of head cement or flex-a-ment and you are in business. There are other options of course...but don't ever believe the plastic things will ever work...just awful!!! The other alternative is dependent on your budget followed by your patience. I just looked on ebay and there are a fair number of necks just listed. They are somewhat picked over and can be had at what could/should be a reasonable price depending on the bidders in the auction. The problem is the large number of split eyes, and this is where your patience comes in. The eyes can be repaired rather well using either a fabric glue or a hot glue gun. Simply get the fibers aligned, add the adhesive of choice to the back of the feather and allow to dry. Voila...you have the real thing and while not super grade AAA perfect they make for fine looking fishing flies. Good luck!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
