To weedguard or not?

[Meeshka 0]

Buddy bought me Dick Brown's bonefish book last weekend and asked me if I would tie him a selection of flies for his bonefish trip to Belize (Ambergris Caye ) May of 2017. I haven't been there in about 8 years, and all I remember is that the guide said my flies were too dense, got out his swiss army knife scissors, and pruned them - these new flies will be sparse. Can't remember if I put weed guards on the flies back then. Most of the selection of patterns I would like to tie ride hook point up and I think that might be enough of a snag deterant. For those that ride hook point down, I intend to put on some type of weed guard. Would this be normal or should I weed guard the lot? Thanks in advance for your suggestions.

 

Doug

[FlatsRoamer 0]

In Mexico I am not sure if he will need them, in places like Biscayne Bay and the Caymans, for sure since of the amount of turtle grass... Either ask him or do some research but remember that you can always clip it off, but you cant add it on the water ...

[mikechell 0]

Belize is NOT Mexico. The waters around Belize are as pristine, or even more so, than those around the popular Caribbean Islands. And it's DEFINITELY better than any water close to Miami.

 

The attendees to my class, from Belize, tell me the fishing there is fantastic. According to them, the fish are so plentiful and unafraid of people that you can use anything and catch fish. Of course, I'm sure some of that is pride of Country ... but still.

[FlatsRoamer 0]

Lol my bad, and yeah of course the fishing there is better than here, with all these crazy boaters and googans...

 

So for Belize I don't think you should add weedguards, but that's your call

[DavidR 0]

If it doubt - It's easier to cut them off when you get there than it is to add them.

[Permitcapt 0]

I never go anywhere without both. Conditions change in all places. Today, in my home-waters of Apalachicola Bay, the flats were festooned with grass that has been shed by the grass beds, as this is the time of year when the grass dies-off. Without a weed-guard there would be no chance of catching a fish. Earlier in the week, no such problem.

[Saltybum 0]

Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

[Adam Saarinen 0]

Just like condoms!

[tidewaterfly 0]

I tie a lot of flies with weed guards, because they're needed in places I'll be fishing. It's easy to snip off a mono weed guard if not needed, but difficult to add when on the water!

Tie them all with, and it won't hurt anything if they're not needed.

[agn54 0]

Just like condoms!

HAHA! this is my new mantra on weed guards

[Capt Bob LeMay 0]

I deliberately waited until a few other folks posted on this topic before chiming in... Yes, I do use weedguards a bit on some bonefish patterns - particularly when the bug is going to be used up on top of heavy grass (turtle grass here in south Florida). What I used to tell my fly-tying students was that the "lawn test" was my standard for weedguards. The test is simple... tie the bug on and drag is slowly across your lawn - if it snags, it's not good enough...

 

For bugs designed to ride hook point up (snapping shrimp, spider crabs, and others) I like an "outrigger style" weedguard. That guard is quite simple -for a #4 hook I use 15lb Ande mono (12lb for a #6 hook). I learned to do this style after I utterly failed with mustache style weedguards... Here's the procedure, tie in everything on the fly except the last 1/8" behind the hook eye then double a piece of 15lb mono (the entire length of the mono when doubled should be the overall length of whatever hook you're using or slightly longer (remember this is only for flies being tied "hook up" in the vise and designed to fish with hook up...). The loop of mono is tied in on top of the hook shank, using the last bit of the doubled mono with the loop facing forward. The rest of the fly is then finished until you have all the materials in place but the thread is not quite finished. As you finish up the thread head lift the loop above the horizontal and do five or six strong turns of thread in front of the loop to stand it up at about a 45 degree angle to the hook shank, still leaning forward - then whip finish and you're done with the tying portion - but still not quite done overall... Your last step, while the fly is still in the vise is to cut the loop exactly in the center with a small pair of nippers. You now have two arms facing forward at that 45 degree angle - but curved in toward each other - spread them apart at a 45 degree angle then straighten each leg by stroking it between thumb and middle finger with the nail against the outside curve of the mono (the exact same way you'd use your fingernail and thumb to put a curve into a ribbon...). When done each arm is straight and still angled 45 degrees from the horizontal and 45 degrees apart from the other arm. The very last step is a tiny drop of thin super glue (I use Krazy Glue) on the thread instead of any head cement. The super glue locks everything into place - particularly your weedguard... and you won't find any other type of guard that works as well - particularly on grass bottomed areas. I've got pics of it on the thread "Turneffe Crab" that I just posted today.... if you want to see what the fuss is about...

 

After all this talk of weedguards, though, there's actually something that I think is more important about bonefish bugs for different areas. That is -to have more than one size tied up in a given pattern (#4s might be standard here in south Florida - but #6 or even smaller might be the standard somewhere else...). Along with a variety of hook sizes for your chosen patterns you're also going to want a selection of weights for bonefish bugs - and that you'll achieve by using beadchain eyes or lead eyes - or maybe no eyes at all... I've been told by more than one angler down in the Caribbean that his (or her) guide took their favorite "Charlie" pattern and quickly cut the eyes off of it. The resulting pattern is called a "blind charlie" by some that I know....

 

Put simply, a bug for less than two feet of water with no noticeable current needs very different sink characteristics than a bug in three or four feet of water along the edge of a channel with a good current.. If your bug isn't on the bottom it just won't get noticed....

[AndrewP 0]

OK, I asked this question of Capt. LeMay in another thread, but it's probably better if he answers it here (not to derail the other thread) ...

 

Capt Lemay: As I understand it relating to you choice in weedguards, you prefer the single wire weedguard for most fishing situations? I know you like the upright, 45degree-forward "V" guard in mono for your bonefish flies in turtlegrass as you mentioned above.

 

Wondered if you would be so kind to break down what conditions (grass, rock, mangrove roots, etc.) or what other situations would dictate one type of weedguard vs. another for you.

 

Many thanks in advance.

 

 

Andrew

[Capt Bob LeMay 0]

I try to use the wire weedguard on every fly that I tie - but in some cases, popping bugs, traditional tarpon flies, it's just not possible. Remember that weedguard isn't really about weeds it's much more about being able to work a fly in structure, or right on the bottom without snagging it. Just think, if every seventh cast you snag the fly -that's a significant reduction of your productive fishing time in a day on the water. Since we always try to retrieve a snagged fly it means that we're spooking fish off of the spot where the snag is. The fish just don't seem to notice the weedguards so they're on everything I hand to anglers (if possible).

 

As far as bonefish go - I quit doing that more than eight years ago (got really tired of showing fish to anglers and watching them spook away). But I clearly remember what it's like to have a good shot at a big bone (average size in Biscayne Bay is 8 lbs...) and realize that you're snagged up as the fish approaches where the fly is... Pretty frustrating.... no matter what kind of bottom you're on. Lots of bonefish bugs are snag-free by design and don't need a weedguard - if the bug needs one and I can do that without changing the way the fly behaves then it will have one... It's all very situational - as one guy on this thread noted it's easy to cut or break off a weedguard that's not needed but you can't add one out on the water if it isn't there in the first place....