Making deer hair bass bugs durable

[Bryon Anderson 0]

ditz, thanks for your thoughts--I had the same thought about laying some SH or head cement on the bottoms of my existing bugs. It surely couldn't hurt. I'm going to try some Loc-Tite on the thread between bunches of hair, too; that was suggested as an alternative to Zap-a-Gap in a thread that SILKDH just started about different CA glues.

[whatfly 0]

When in doubt and in need greater durability, Dave's Flexament (original or homegrown) is my preferred solution (pun intended). I generally hate using CA glues except as finishing coats. Flexament cures slowly enough to give you time to work, and add a flexible durable bond once it does set. Cannot stand how it smells, but until someone comes up with something better and non-toxic (Liquid Fusion is good but not in the same class), it is the best solution I've found. YMMV.

[JSzymczyk 0]

after trimming, wet the bottom of your deer hair bug with flexament along the hook shank. Thinned flexament is best. Look for the old threads about how to make your own. Let it dry. I've been doing this for years and years and years. It might not make the deer hair TOTALLY fixed to the hook, but it does make it more or less into one solid "thing".... if it rotates a bit when a fish takes it, so what?

[Bryon Anderson 0]

after trimming, wet the bottom of your deer hair bug with flexament along the hook shank. Thinned flexament is best. Look for the old threads about how to make your own. Let it dry. I've been doing this for years and years and years. It might not make the deer hair TOTALLY fixed to the hook, but it does make it more or less into one solid "thing".... if it rotates a bit when a fish takes it, so what?

Thanks JS - several people have suggested Flexament. I'm intrigued by the idea of making my own. I will find that thread and give it a try. And you're right--it's not the end of the world if the hair rotates a bit. I'd just like my bugs to start out as durable as they can be. I'm actually having that same problem with the foam poppers I made recently. The super glue that I used (the 3 tubes for $1 stuff) gave up the ghost the first time out. Now those heads rotate more or less freely, too. They still fish okay, which is the main thing, but it still bugs me (pun not intended).

[sunsignarcher 0]

I watched Pat tie a popper and picked up his vid at a show this year.

 

After each spin or stack he cuts through the hair with the thread coming immediately to the front of each clump. Throws 3 half hitches in and drives those 3 hh into the hair with his packer. He then seals that up with a dab of zap or crazy glue, I don't remember which but I think he used a brush.

[mikechell 0]

 

The super glue that I used (the 3 tubes for $1 stuff) gave up the ghost the first time out. Now those heads rotate more or less freely, too.

There are two "Super Glue" 3-packs, and I use them both. The gel is MUCH better for securing foam popper material to a thread base. Anywhere you need to fill a gap.

The thin original glue is better for securing wraps, deer hair packs and such, where the glue should penetrate.

[ditz2 0]

When I mentioned head cement at the base of each bunch there was no intent to let the stuff dry between bunches. Just spin, drop of cement, then spin another. It may take 2 or 3 days for the cement to totally setup.......When dried it will be very hard. ......Someone mentioned roughing up the hook for a better grip. You will be inviting rust and the rust will be hidden until you hook a nice fish and the hook breaks. It is not wise to disturb the coating on any hook. Rust will result.

[Bryon Anderson 0]

mikechell - thanks for the tip on the super glue gel vs. liquid. I've never tried the gel, so I'll have to give it a try.

 

ditz you are right about rust resulting when you disturb the coating on a hook. I speak from the very experience you used as an example of what can happen. ah, well...I was going to release him anyway.

[add147 0]

Ok all I am totally confused now!!!! LOL...Of course that is not to hard to do to me since I destroyed some brain cells in my youth. So it is better to use CA glue or head cement?

 

Also for what its worth for those of you that have a Harbour Freight Tool Store near you some times they sell a 5 pack of CA glue for a dollar. I bought some back in May and I am still in my first tube.

[flytire 0]

does anybody really think all this gluing is a permanent bond or will everything loosen up with prolonged contact with water or even a fish shaking all over the place?

[Capt Bob LeMay 0]

Here's the routine I follow when I want a deer haired bug to be particularly durable (sometimes I don't want a bug to be very durable since it fishes better as it gets soggy and slightly twisted…)….

 

I like spinning hair on a bare shank like many then make a point of touching each bundle of hair, after it's spun into position and packed, with the tiniest drop of CA glue right at the hook shank (I like thin super glue and prefer Krazy glue in the tube since I can apply the stuff exactly where needed - and nowhere else). When the head is completed, then trimmed, then razored down to its final form I use a last drop of CA glue on the whip finished thread. Now for the durable part...

 

I use Flex Seal to coat the completed head and use a good bit since it gets absorbed by the head. When it dries you have a hardened deer head and also have protected the super glue from moisture… and that's important since water deteriorates super glue…. Hope this helps.

[mikechell 0]

does anybody really think all this gluing is a permanent bond or will everything loosen up with prolonged contact with water or even a fish shaking all over the place?

I don't know if it makes "Permanent" bond, but it outlast the life of the fly. I've rarely had a fly actually fall apart, and it's never happened with my deer hair flies. I've lost, bent, cut or broken the point of the hooks of all the flies I replaced ... never because the glue failed and the fly disintegrated.

[SILKHDH 0]

I'm going to look into the flexament thing too. The "makes it into more or less one solid thing" like JS stated is what helps on the deer hair flies. Like I said I have some purchased deer hair flies and they no doubt have some kind of substance on the hair making it stiff and adhered together.

 

P.S. The results are in on the CA glue debate. I called LOC-TITE. Was a lesson learned.

Go to the CA glue forum.

[TheCream 0]

As a regular bass bugger, here are my thoughts.

 

1) Yes I use Liquid Fusion and I love that stuff. I use it to coat the bellies of my bugs. You could use it to coat the whole thing if you wanted, I just coat the bellies to seal them. It does seem to keep them floating longer by keeping them from absorbing as much water. It also seems to make them pretty durable. The best part about it is how it dries. It sort of "sucks into" the hair, shrinking a little as it dries. Put it on thick, it will self level and cure flat to the bottom of the bug. On poppers, I also coat the faces but instead use a UV cure glue for the speed. I'll smear it into the face, which keeps it flat and uniform (UV Knot Sense is pretty tacky before curing), then hit it with a UV light. Liquid Fusion would not work as well for this since it takes longer to cure and the hair could become unruly before drying.

 

2) As for hair spinning on the shank, I do not glue in between each clump/bundle of hair and have not had this issue. I actually used a bass bug over the weekend that hadn't been used in at least a year. I caught two bass on it and missed a few more, the body of the bug never budged. All I do between bundles is half hitch and have not had heads rotate.

 

3) I really think the recipe for making a deer hair bug more durable is in the density of the bug. My earlier bugs with less dense hair didn't handle abuse that well. They also didn't float as well (for as long). Since I started getting my bodies much more dense, they float better, float longer, and handle blows better. I have some older sliders I tied a few years ago that have been used for multiple seasons and caught several bass, and they don't look much different than they did when they came off the vise.

 

4) And nice bug you posted. I dig those colors!

[Bryon Anderson 0]

As a regular bass bugger, here are my thoughts.

 

1) Yes I use Liquid Fusion and I love that stuff. I use it to coat the bellies of my bugs. You could use it to coat the whole thing if you wanted, I just coat the bellies to seal them. It does seem to keep them floating longer by keeping them from absorbing as much water. It also seems to make them pretty durable. The best part about it is how it dries. It sort of "sucks into" the hair, shrinking a little as it dries. Put it on thick, it will self level and cure flat to the bottom of the bug. On poppers, I also coat the faces but instead use a UV cure glue for the speed. I'll smear it into the face, which keeps it flat and uniform (UV Knot Sense is pretty tacky before curing), then hit it with a UV light. Liquid Fusion would not work as well for this since it takes longer to cure and the hair could become unruly before drying.

 

2) As for hair spinning on the shank, I do not glue in between each clump/bundle of hair and have not had this issue. I actually used a bass bug over the weekend that hadn't been used in at least a year. I caught two bass on it and missed a few more, the body of the bug never budged. All I do between bundles is half hitch and have not had heads rotate.

 

3) I really think the recipe for making a deer hair bug more durable is in the density of the bug. My earlier bugs with less dense hair didn't handle abuse that well. They also didn't float as well (for as long). Since I started getting my bodies much more dense, they float better, float longer, and handle blows better. I have some older sliders I tied a few years ago that have been used for multiple seasons and caught several bass, and they don't look much different than they did when they came off the vise.

 

4) And nice bug you posted. I dig those colors!

 

Cream -

 

1. thanks for the feedback on Liquid Fusion. I'm glad to hear that it works well on deer hair. I will definitely be picking some up and giving it a try.

2. & 3.I agree with you completely that making deer hair bugs as dense as possible goes a long way toward making them more buoyant and durable. That's been my experience as well--as I've gotten better at stacking and packing, and as I've begun using higher quality hair and better tools (GSP thread and the Fugly Packer), I have noticed that my bugs float higher and remain afloat longer, and that they hold up better too.

4. Thanks! I like those colors too. That bug was the result of my giving up on trying to make beautiful, symmetrical designs with 2 or 3 stacked colors a la Pat Cohen, and simply alternating two colors and letting them flare at random however they wanted to.