Whiting hackles

[vicente 0]

http://collinshacklefarm.com/Home.asp

 

The commercial grab bag if there's one color or two specific ones you want if you let him know he may try to throw them in for you.

[Piker20 0]

Piker a are they good in the 14-20 range? And truly whiting level quality on the feathers? At $25 a whole cape that's 1/3 the cost of a whiting bronze...

 

Ebrant from this forum has some great hackle under his sideling hill hackle. I have an early cape and it's up there with prograde whiting. His newer line will be better still.

So do the feathers go down to 20s? Id be interested. Does he have a website? Or anywhere I can see is hackles?

Hi guys. I have a pro grade whiting (circa 2008)and one of Evans first capes. Definitely comparable in terms of usable hackle length and sizes. I was amazed if I'm honest. I've tied down to 24 with both but obviously there are not as many feathers in the small sizes as you'd have on a specific midge cape.

Evan sells in uk on ETSY. I'm sure if you pm him he'll get back to you.

It really comes down to if you're tying on a production level. A silver grade whiting will prob tie at least 5 flies per hackle. The pro grade is two at most.

[TheCream 0]

 

If you need something specific, I would strongly consider going over to Fly Fish Food's site and checking out their graded flash hackle. No guess work in buying, they tell you the sizes and grade you're getting.

$115 for a silver grade black??? Lol. The going price is $90. I think not. Even at my local fly shops they are $90. Too rich for my blood. I can get a gold grade for $5 more. Haha. I stopped after looking at the first 5 on that flash sale. Too much money.

 

 

The risk is entirely up to you. You can buy hackle cheaper, it's not debatable. But what you are buying is guaranteed to be what you need. Buying hackle sight-unseen can be pretty risky, and if you're willing to take that risk, go for it. If you need size 18-20 and get a cape with more 14-16 feathers, then your cheaper cape might be mostly unusable. The flash hackle, the reason it's more expensive is because there's no risk. Or you could go with 100 packs, which are obviously less bang for your buck, but again, you're getting exactly what you need and nothing else.

 

And keep in mind, you're shopping for midge grade dry fly hackle. You're going to pay for it. This stuff isn't coming from Fly Tyer's Dungeon for $10.

[Mike West 0]

All I can is thank God I dont tie trout flies any more or have the need for high quality hackle..I still have pieces of a #1 Metz from close to 50 years ago thats gets me by for the warm water stuff I do....thats right 50 years old.

 

Some of the quills are brittle now so I just pull on them hard to check them to see if they are going break while winding them..if they do well then its tailing material for some other fly.

 

If I had to buy $60-$100 necks I couldnt afford to tie.

 

I am running out of current necks Ive had for 20 years though and Im about to have to buy some American Rooster necks to tie my bass bugs I like to tie and those are like $40-$45 and I need 6 colors..thats an investment to me.

[TheCream 0]

All I can is thank God I dont tie trout flies any more or have the need for high quality hackle..I still have pieces of a #1 Metz from close to 50 years ago thats gets me by for the warm water stuff I do....thats right 50 years old.

 

Some of the quills are brittle now so I just pull on them hard to check them to see if they are going break while winding them..if they do well then its tailing material for some other fly.

 

If I had to buy $60-$100 necks I couldnt afford to tie.

 

I am running out of current necks Ive had for 20 years though and Im about to have to buy some American Rooster necks to tie my bass bugs I like to tie and those are like $40-$45 and I need 6 colors..thats an investment to me.

 

I'm probably in the minority on this, and I preface it with I'm not a die hard trout fisherman, but I see hackle as a luxury item. I tie a good deal of trout flies for trips and buddies, and I almost never use hackle on a non-parachute dry. I can't even tell you the last time I used a "standard hackled" dry fly for trout. If it's not a parachute, I use lots of deer hair comparaduns and CDC or snowshoe rabbit duns. CDC, snowshoe, and deer hair: cheap. Hackle: expensive. I think the original poster is in a little bit of a trickier situation trying to tie dries that small. It would be harder to tie hackle-free dries that size, in my opinion. Possible but harder. Most of mine are in the 12-16 range and avoiding hackle is easy.

[RickZieger 0]

Most of the hackle I have no I got from Conranch . I saw Denny at SowBug and picked up more than I will probably ever use.

 

Rick

[Sandan 0]

 

All I can is thank God I dont tie trout flies any more or have the need for high quality hackle..I still have pieces of a #1 Metz from close to 50 years ago thats gets me by for the warm water stuff I do....thats right 50 years old.

 

Some of the quills are brittle now so I just pull on them hard to check them to see if they are going break while winding them..if they do well then its tailing material for some other fly.

 

If I had to buy $60-$100 necks I couldnt afford to tie.

 

I am running out of current necks Ive had for 20 years though and Im about to have to buy some American Rooster necks to tie my bass bugs I like to tie and those are like $40-$45 and I need 6 colors..thats an investment to me.

 

I'm probably in the minority on this, and I preface it with I'm not a die hard trout fisherman, but I see hackle as a luxury item. I tie a good deal of trout flies for trips and buddies, and I almost never use hackle on a non-parachute dry. I can't even tell you the last time I used a "standard hackled" dry fly for trout. If it's not a parachute, I use lots of deer hair comparaduns and CDC or snowshoe rabbit duns. CDC, snowshoe, and deer hair: cheap. Hackle: expensive. I think the original poster is in a little bit of a trickier situation trying to tie dries that small. It would be harder to tie hackle-free dries that size, in my opinion. Possible but harder. Most of mine are in the 12-16 range and avoiding hackle is easy.

 

You're correct about using hair and CDC when possible instead of hackle. Comparaduns down to 24 are doable, it's tricky with such short hair but not too bad. Also CDC spinners. Kelly Galloup's found link uses hair, no hackle and antron or ep 3d they float just fine. Collar hackle sometimes is just what you need. I don't know if I agree that hackle is a luxury item, but there's no need to go out and buy a bunch of necks (capes and/or saddles) all at one time. I also agree that those cape tops can be just what the tying doctor ordered. They look to me that they'll go from 18 to 22 or 24. You just have to be delicate when you wind such small feathers. We've tied 26 and 28 midges with the small cape feathers, no probs. To add your point about paying extra for midge grade saddles was right on, they always have a premium tacked on to them.

[edit] I'm a die hard trouter [edit]

[Dave G. 0]

I buy Metz #2 necks from JStockard when they have their Metz sale on ( which I think might be on now,or maybe it was last month). But those have a nice collection of small hackles in the narrow of the neck and a lot of size 18-12 sizes as well. And then along the outer sides are some large softer hackles I have used in streamers from time to time.. In my age range and for the amount of flies I tie in certain colors I often buy the half necks. Half necks on sale there in Metz #2 are $28.. Whiting are awesome though but I live on a retirement budget now and the fish don't seem to care if it's Whiting or Metz on the fly so far..

 

Incidentally this all started when I wanted buff colored medium dun hackles and all whiting had were too dark in grey to blue grey at the time. I got natural dun from Metz where the whitings were dyed. However the color was more important to me than the number of flies I could get from one feather. Metz #2 has turned out to fit my nitch, it ticks most of the boxes I'm looking for.. Course that is a personal thing, someone else may not agree at all.

[spiralspey 0]

I'm primarily a dry fly guy, I also don't like spending a lot of cash for things I'm not likely to use. So I stick with the whiting silver half capes and saddles in just a few colors, the ones I use the most, grizzly, brown, and dark dun. I can tie an awful lot of flies from one half cape and if I feel I need another color hackle for a few flies, like black or olive, I've just bought economy saddles from metz or whoever. You can spend an awful lot of money buying hackles, but there really is no need to.

[tjm 0]

When the hackle is on the water and looked up at by a fish, does the shade or color actually show enough to make a difference?

I should think that grizzly or a light dun would nearly disappear against the sky.

[rstaight 0]

When I started tying mayfly patterns, the first cape I purchased was Grizzly. Then I added Brown and Medium Dun. After that came Black and Ginger.

 

What I use the most today may sound strange. I use a Purple saddle that I died for the hackle and Brown hen for the wings. Don't know what it's called but one my buddies bought some online years ago and was so effective I started tying them my self.

[spiralspey 0]

When the hackle is on the water and looked up at by a fish, does the shade or color actually show enough to make a difference?

I should think that grizzly or a light dun would nearly disappear against the sky.

I definitely agree with you there, that's why I don't worry too much about hackle color on my dries.

 

I also agree with thecream, I just don't fish any flies tied with a standard hackle any more, it's more likely a parachute or something without hackle. When I do use flies with upright hackles it's usually a thorax pattern or something like an elk hair caddis. In either case I usually clip the hackle on the underside of the fly. With any of those flies, parachute, thorax, or caddis I usually use a hackle a size or two bigger, it helps float the fly better. Because of that I don't often need tiny sized hackles.

[tjm 0]

Does a #22> even need hackle? I don't use them any more but my extra small nymphs and wets always seem to fish in the film.

[chugbug27 0]

Don't forget the Whiting intro pack... I didn't buy that when I got back into tying but should have... 4 half capes (I think pro grade) including grizzly and brown for about $60

[McFlyLures 0]

Don't forget the Whiting intro pack... I didn't buy that when I got back into tying but should have... 4 half capes (I think pro grade) including grizzly and brown for about $60

Yeah I was looking at that, however the pro grade I hear only really goes down to size 16-18, with a limited quantity of feathers on the 18s and 20s